Immigration

[neoplacebo]

Oh and by the way, the last 2 years of Bush's term the Congress and Senate were both controlled by Democrats, why didn't they impeach Bush?????
[/color]

Easy; acute ignorance and terminal stupidity aren't impeachable offenses.

[O Really]

Ragin Redneck says, "...But to the Baby mama's who have 15 kids by 10 or 12 different daddies who's greatest ambition was to be a drug dealer or a pimp or are serving the next 25 to life in prison, I say screw em, along with the terminally lazy."

I think I see where he's coming from. He's focused on a certain stereotype that exists but comprises a very small percentage of those who are eligible for a variety of government benefits and decided to paint all recipients with the same brush. He wants everyone to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps but doesn't realize a lot of people don't have boots. He wants everybody to get a job, but doesn't realize that nobody is going to hire a person with no skills. And getting skills is expensive. He has never read Vroom's theory of motivation, that says for a person to be motivated to do something (like get educated, get a job, etc.), s/he has to (a) believe s/he is able to do (whatever0 (b) s/he has to believe s/he'll get rewarded in some meaningful way; and (c) s/he has to find the reward desirable. Take away any one or more of those three, and the person will be unable to do anything. If nobody in your family has been able to keep a job, and nobody has an education, and nobody can afford to move away, your entire world and how you perceive it is different from, for example, mine. My dad escaped Great Depression poverty through the military - was a decorated Marine and went to college on the GI Bill (no Baby Mama him). He also had a job as a steel worker to support my mom and me. But by the time I was old enough to be influenced, I was surrounded by successful people, and was encouraged to follow my dreams. I got my undergraduate out of state tuition paid for because my family could afford it; I also benefited from damgummint money going to law school. I had encouragement, upper middle class status, and that brought opportunity. Compare that privileged situation to those who don't know how they're going to feed their kid, who didn't make it thorough high school and don't know anybody who did, and then tell them to "get a job." BTW, I wonder if Ragin Redneck knows the percentage of those eligible for SNAP who do have full-time jobs. Or those eligible for unemployment who - up to a certain point - had kept jobs all their lives. I wonder if he knows the real facts about the "free Obama cell phone" or how much the average person actually receives in government benefits. I wonder if he'd trade his life for theirs. Sure, there's some fraud. There's fraud everywhere, and it's not limited to welfare recipients. Some of it is by doctors and hospitals (like the one formerly owned by the Governor of Florida) who cheat Medicare. Study the numbers. Learn some facts somewhere other than Michael Savage and World Nut Daily. Find out who benefits from government programs and what the percentage of fraud is, and who is committing the greatest amount of that fraud. Like that's ever going to happen. No intelligence is transmitted to a closed mind.

[JTA]

Ragin Redneck says, "...But to the Baby mama's who have 15 kids by 10 or 12 different daddies who's greatest ambition was to be a drug dealer or a pimp or are serving the next 25 to life in prison, I say screw em, along with the terminally lazy."

I think I see where he's coming from. He's focused on a certain stereotype that exists but comprises a very small percentage of those who are eligible for a variety of government benefits and decided to paint all recipients with the same brush. He wants everyone to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps but doesn't realize a lot of people don't have boots. He wants everybody to get a job, but doesn't realize that nobody is going to hire a person with no skills. And getting skills is expensive. He has never read Vroom's theory of motivation, that says for a person to be motivated to do something (like get educated, get a job, etc.), s/he has to (a) believe s/he is able to do (whatever0 (b) s/he has to believe s/he'll get rewarded in some meaningful way; and (c) s/he has to find the reward desirable. Take away any one or more of those three, and the person will be unable to do anything. If nobody in your family has been able to keep a job, and nobody has an education, and nobody can afford to move away, your entire world and how you perceive it is different from, for example, mine. My dad escaped Great Depression poverty through the military - was a decorated Marine and went to college on the GI Bill (no Baby Mama him). He also had a job as a steel worker to support my mom and me. But by the time I was old enough to be influenced, I was surrounded by successful people, and was encouraged to follow my dreams. I got my undergraduate out of state tuition paid for because my family could afford it; I also benefited from damgummint money going to law school. I had encouragement, upper middle class status, and that brought opportunity. Compare that privileged situation to those who don't know how they're going to feed their kid, who didn't make it thorough high school and don't know anybody who did, and then tell them to "get a job." BTW, I wonder if Ragin Redneck knows the percentage of those eligible for SNAP who do have full-time jobs. Or those eligible for unemployment who - up to a certain point - had kept jobs all their lives. I wonder if he knows the real facts about the "free Obama cell phone" or how much the average person actually receives in government benefits. I wonder if he'd trade his life for theirs. Sure, there's some fraud. There's fraud everywhere, and it's not limited to welfare recipients. Some of it is by doctors and hospitals (like the one formerly owned by the Governor of Florida) who cheat Medicare. Study the numbers. Learn some facts somewhere other than Michael Savage and World Nut Daily. Find out who benefits from government programs and what the percentage of fraud is, and who is committing the greatest amount of that fraud. Like that's ever going to happen. No intelligence is transmitted to a closed mind.

Great post.

I especially feel for kids who grow up in shit homes with terrible parents and no role models to look up to. They don't stand a chance.

[Ragin Rebel]

Ragin Rebel,

Setting aside your fake Obama quotes and pig-ignorant claims about America (As just a start, America is indeed a democracy. Yes, it's also a Republic. The two are not mutually exclusive)....

I challenge you to find ANYWHERE in our founding documents...The Declaration of Independence, our Constitution, or the Federalist papers where it says we are a democracy. It can't be done. We live in a Constitutional Republic where We the People elect our representatives with enumerated powers. The power first comes from the people and our concerns are sent along to DC with our reps. Well that's the way it is supposed to be. And we also live in a society that promotes Capitalism and not State-ism. The people we send to Washington work for us, not us for them.
As Hitler said 'If you tell a big enough lie and tell it frequently enough, it will be believed', and that is where you get that belief that we are a democracy. Even though it is spouted by Democrats and Republicans alike, it's still a lie. Even Karl Marx said "Democracy is the road to socialism." Democracy has always been considered as "Mob Rule".

The common theme I'm seeing from you is that everything you declare unconstitutional or "socialist", was also Republican policy before Obama took power. So could we please narrow this down?

What Obama's policies do you disapprove of, that weren't Republican policy until Obama adopted them?

Sure a lot of RINO's have went astray, and they were wrong because they caved to minority loud mouths to shut them up. But we are looking at such as with Obamacare, middle class working families losing coverage, paying more tax for it (remember Obamacare is a tax as sited by the Supreme Court) to fund the healthcare of useless eaters and breathers, and illegals who have no right to be here in the first place.
We have had immigration laws in place since 1790. These laws have rules for potential immigrants to legally become Naturalized citizens. But over time and presidential administrations and pressure from special interests to create a cheap labor force, the enforcement of the rules and laws got slack, enfocerment officers turned their heads and now we have the problem we do today. Only worse because Obama chooses not to enforce the law. He's not the only one to grant a form of Amnesty, "Slick Willie" done an "Obama Lite" in 1996 to increase the Democrat voter roles. Reagan done it and I think Bush (41 & 43) done it too. That's not to say I am against it no matter who done it. Just because I vote Republican doesn't mean I always agree with them. I am more of a strict Constitutionalist.

[Ragin Rebel]

I wonder how many of Ragin Rebel's ancestors who "have fought in every war since the Declaration of Independence was written" accepted veterans' benefits? Maybe Ragin Rebel, too.

What does Veterans benefits have to do with it??? If their enlistment contract promised them benefits, they are entitled to them. It is a bonus for the low military pay and the sacrifice of being away from family, injuries from combat and disability.

[Ragin Rebel]

Ragin Redneck says, "...But to the Baby mama's who have 15 kids by 10 or 12 different daddies who's greatest ambition was to be a drug dealer or a pimp or are serving the next 25 to life in prison, I say screw em, along with the terminally lazy."

I thinkassume I see where he's coming from. He's focused on a certain stereotype that exists but comprises a very small percentage of those who are eligible for a variety of government benefits and decided to paint all recipients with the same brush.

I'm not painting them all with the same brush! I know there are some that actually do deserve government benefits, due to disability from birth, hurt on the job, etc..


He wants everyone to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps but doesn't realize a lot of people don't have boots.

The best place to find a helping hand is at the end of your arm. And who's fault is it that they don't have boots??? Their own!!!


He wants everybody to get a job, but doesn't realize that nobody is going to hire a person with no skills. And getting skills is expensive.

Yes I believe every able bodied person should pull their own weight. Everyone has some skill, even if it's using a shovel to dig a hole, or sweeping a floor. Hell even dogs work!!! If a person is motivated to live and eat, they will find a way to learn.


He has never read Vroom's theory of motivation, that says for a person to be motivated to do something (like get educated, get a job, etc.), s/he has to (a) believe s/he is able to do (whatever0 (b) s/he has to believe s/he'll get rewarded in some meaningful way; and (c) s/he has to find the reward desirable. Take away any one or more of those three, and the person will be unable to do anything.


Thanks to LBJ's Great Society, people have been educated to depend on the welfare system to keep them up. This has been going on for 50 years. They have been motivated to believe they can ride the welfare train for generations. They believe that they are getting their reward with every new birth of another baby, and that increase in WIC and SNAP along with that EBT card. And they find their reward very rewarding. And they are happy being uneducated or to have to do anything.
Jesus said in the Bible, you don't work, you don't eat.




If nobody in your family has been able to keep a job, and nobody has an education, and nobody can afford to move away, your entire world and how you perceive it is different from, for example, mine.

My Grand parents and parent lived through the Great Depression, but other than the rationing during WWII, they really didn't notice. They were lucky to be farmers, they worked their farm, Grandpa also worked in the cotton mill and cut hair on Saturdays, while his older boys sold produce in the Spartanburg area. Grandma and the girls had the talent to sew, so they made the men and boys shirts, their own dresses, and sewed for others. Grandpa always had chickens, pigs and a few cows for meat milk and eggs. Grandpa was quite talented in building furniture also. And Grandpa was also a WWI veteran.


My dad escaped Great Depression poverty through the military - was a decorated Marine and went to college on the GI Bill (no Baby Mama him). He also had a job as a steel worker to support my mom and me. But by the time I was old enough to be influenced, I was surrounded by successful people, and was encouraged to follow my dreams. I got my undergraduate out of state tuition paid for because my family could afford it; I also benefited from damgummint money going to law school. I had encouragement, upper middle class status, and that brought opportunity.


Your father sounds like a very motivated man that done what it took to better himself and his family beyond his roots. And his military service is appreciated.


Compare that privileged situation to those who don't know how they're going to feed their kid, who didn't make it thorough high school and don't know anybody who did, and then tell them to "get a job."

Every man or woman with determination can get work. If you have a few tools, a lawn mower and a truck or car with a large trunk, you can find work. And if you are fair with those you work for, that word of mouth advertising will in time keep you busier than a set of jumper cables at Obama's funeral. That was how I done business, I never advertised other than the sign above my shop door, 99% was word of mouth. And I can say I have done pretty well. I'm not a millionaire by a long shot, but I'm comfortable.


BTW, I wonder if Ragin Redneck knows the percentage of those eligible for SNAP who do have full-time jobs.

A lot of them are in our own US military right now.


Or those eligible for unemployment who - up to a certain point - had kept jobs all their lives.

Used to be if you lost your job, through no fault of your own 26 weeks was the max, and your benefits were rated as to how many credits you had. Now people get it for close to 2 years. But it is just one of the secret Santa gifts to convert those people to vote Democrat and let the government help them live their lives.


I wonder if he knows the real facts about the "free Obama cell phone" or how much the average person actually receives in government benefits.


I know it cost me about $4.00 a month in Gubment fees to pay for it.


I wonder if he'd trade his life for theirs.


Why would I trade down, I worked hard for what I've got. They could do the same.

Sure, there's some fraud. There's fraud everywhere, and it's not limited to welfare recipients.
Some of it is by doctors and hospitals (like the one formerly owned by the Governor of Florida) who cheat Medicare. Study the numbers. Learn some facts somewhere other than Michael Savage and World Nut Daily.

I know there is fraud, by recipients and providers, but I have no enforcement powers to investigate or correct the problem.


I don't listen to or read Michael Savage, I do like World Net Daily.

Find out who benefits from government programs and what the percentage of fraud is, and who is committing the greatest amount of that fraud. Like that's ever going to happen. No intelligence is transmitted to a closed mind.

A lot of our Reps "Special Interest" groups are making a killing, along with friends and family of politicians. You under estimate how well informed I am. And I don't have a closed mind, just a set mind.

[Ragin Rebel]

I don't screw up!!!!

You can't even format the colors of a web post without screwing up, and you're too much of a lazy slacker to fix your screw ups.

Your little web site screwed that up. That happens. Get over it.

I don't lie!!

You've lied for more than 2 years with this nonquote. In other words, every single post of yours on any topic has been a lie. You don't tell the truth, not even once.

Getting a little sensitive about that quote ain't you Vrede??? And just because YOU claim I'm a liar don't make it true. It's just your way of floundering, trying to convince others that you are superior. You're not, you get into your pants the same way I do mine, that is if you wear pants. I picture you in a cheap showgirl dress 3 sizes too small.

Snopes is well known to support the Liberal Progressive agenda, and like all Libs, they lie their asses off,

Translation: Snopes is well known for making fools of RWNJ dupes and slackers like Ragin Rebel that are incapable of doing competent research or even reading a book, therefore they must be "Liberal Progressive".

Translation: Snopes is owned by a Liberal Lefty couple in California and they are heavily financed by George Soros; a big time supporter of Obama!
Snopes has lied on many occasions concerning Obama, such as an e-mail about court dockets of Elana Kagan who Obama appointed, and Snopes said the email was false and there were no such dockets so they were Googled. The Supreme Court, typed in Obama-Kagan, and guess what? Yep you got it; Snopes Lied! Everyone of those dockets are there. Kagan was representing Obama in all the petitions to prove his citizenship. Now she may help rule on them. Now we know why Obama nominated Elana Kagan for the Supreme Court. Pull up the Supreme Courts website, go to the docket and search for Obama Kagan. She was the Solicitor General for all the suits against him filed with the Supreme Court to show proof of natural born citizenship. He owed her big time. All of the requests were denied of course. They were never heard.




This is not rocket surgery, idiot. Either your nonquote is in the book or it isn't. No credible source, none, says it is and you're just too wussy to admit it after having been so stunningly stupid for more than 2 years.

I could care less if the quote is right or wrong, I just love to piss of Liberals with it. But I still won't read any of Obama or Ayers bullshit. I see how he has coddled the Muslims (make you happy now???) so if it quacks like a duck, and walks like a duck, it's a fucking duck!!!!

and dumb ass low information voters believe them,

You're the dumb ass low information voter that posts imaginary quotes.

Really pisses you off don't it??? Then my job is complete for today!!!

just like they believe the Federal Reserve is actually part of the Federal Government instead of a privately owned banking cartel in the business to make a profit.

Non sequitur and too idiotic to know it.

Sorry Vrede, you're the one who has no idea of how the Federal Reserve works, not really, just what has been pumped into that head of yours. Educate yourself and get back to me.

Anyhow, let's see the link to the Snopes post you're referring to. Don't run away from the challenge.

Regardless:

The authority of the Federal Reserve System is derived from statutes enacted by the U.S. Congress and the System is subject to congressional oversight.

Article 1 Section 8 Clause 5 of the Constitution gives Congress the power To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;. Congress cannot shirk their duty or sublet it off to a private entity. Only they have the power to coin money.
The constitution in Article I, section 10 reads "No state shall...coin money, emit bills of credit, make any thing but gold and silver a tender in payment of debts..." This means that the only constitutionally valid forms of money are gold or silver coin. This is called 'lawful money.' U.S. paper money used to be redeemable in lawful money, but no more. Thanks to the Federal Reserve. This now allows them to create money out of thin air, loan it to us with interest. An investment that cost the Fed nearly nothing.

Article 1 Section 8 clause 6 says Congress has the power :'To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current Coin of the United States; Counterfeiting is exactly what the Federal Reserve is doing unpunished for 101 years. Congress cannot even get total access to audit the Fed, and they have never been audited.



The members of the Board of Governors, including its chair and vice-chair, are chosen by the President and confirmed by the Senate.

The president is told by his puppet masters from the Fed who to chose and the Senate under threat confirms them. Remeber he who holds the gold rules the nation.

The federal government sets the salaries of the Board's seven governors. Nationally chartered commercial banks are required to hold stock in the Federal Reserve Bank of their region; this entitles them to elect some of the members of the board of the regional Federal Reserve Bank. Thus the Federal Reserve system has both public and private aspects.

The U.S. Government receives all of the system's annual profits, after a statutory dividend of 6% on member banks' capital investment is paid, and an account surplus is maintained. In 2010, the Federal Reserve made a profit of $82 billion and transferred $79 billion to the U.S. Treasury.

The Gubermint is paid off in counterfeit cash, the Fed gets the gold.

References 18-22

By the way I am smart enough to stay away from the Progressive agenda, and not destroy this nation the way Democrats have since 1913.

101 years, some of that more con than the GOP, and we're still here after destroying a bunch of other countries. Try to make sense.

You're babbling make some sense.

And I am smart enough to critically think for myself.

Not when it comes to an obviously invented quote. You're not even smart enough to look it up after 2 years. You just keep digging your hole deeper.

Still pissed about the quote eh??? At least I'm getting under your skin.

That is the very reason that I am debt free. House paid for, cars, trucks, tractors and everything else paid off.

Dumb. "debt free" is not a partisan issue. In fact, your Shrub turned surpluses into deficits.

I didn't mean for it to be a partisan issue, I was just blowing my own horn a little!!!

I am smart enough to believe in a Supreme Creator and his word. I have no fantasy that I am my own god.

Translation: I believe in sky fairies without any evidence and think that makes me "smart".

I hope I'm there the day you stand before God, just so I can say "I told you so"!!!

And I'm smart enough to know that the lefts (ironic sic) agenda to promote Man Made Global warming is all bullshit to bilk more and more money out of Americans.

Right, it's a grand conspiracy perpetrated by almost all relevant scientists.

Yeah by Dick heads like Al Gore and those who wish to profit from "Carbon Credits".

There's no OZONE layer, it's called the Ionosphere and the so called hole in it is a natural occurring event that has been going on since the first day God turned the light on this planet.

Damage to the ozone layer is different from AGW. You can't even keep your wingnut rants straight.

Any Global Warming is caused by the activity of the sun. Simple science.

And I'm smart enough to know that there has never been any medical data proving people are born Queer.

Right, it's a grand conspiracy perpetrated by almost all relevant scientists.

I've never seen any credible evidence from any scientist.

I prefer not to read the blather and pablum that spews from Obama or Bill Ayers.

Point proven, too lazy and wussy to even try to find your supposed quote.

Ah that quote again!! I could care less whether it's totally worded correctly or not, but the proof of Obama's 6 years is evident.

Non sequitur and too idiotic to know it.

If I want to read lies, I'd read your posts.

Find a supposed lie of mine. Good luck. Provide a credible citation, we know how you are.

I have seen your lies on many posts, but I am too busy to hunt through them, some of us actually have a job to pay for all the dead beats in this nation. Mr. B and Indigo would probably be your best source to expose the posts you have lied in. And come to think of ot I believe you told a few whoppers in this post I'm repying to.

How about the release of 5 terrorist for a deserter without the consent of Congress, which is the law of the land???

Point ducked, wuss. That has nothing to do with where most federal spending goes and which nation gets more foreign aid than any other.

Really??? Those terrorist can cause enough damage over there that would cause us to get more involved than we really want to.

Or changing the Obamacare TAX without the consent of Congress?? Only Congress can write law, or levy TAXES not the POTUS, he does not have that enumerated power.

Non sequitur and too idiotic to know it. Where's the SCOTUS slap or impeachment?


So are you saying Obama or any other POTUS has the power to change or levy taxes???.



And how about the terrorist he just released this past Thursday without the consent of Congress again????? In both cases where terrorist were released, they are back in the war zones with ISIS.

Your Shrub released more.

The interesting thing here is that you're so infatuated with the feds that you think they should hold people indefinitely without trial. Totalitarian much?

Personally I don't consider them people and they have NO RIGHTS here they. When did President Bush release terrorist???

I am honest.

You can't even be honest about an obviously invented quote, after 2 years!

That quote again!!! Really knocks you off balance!!!

Obama has put down the Israelis in this last attack on a Synagogue in Israel by Palestinians, claiming too many Palestinians have died.

Too many Palestinians have died.

No they haven't. When they quit attacking Israel, then that will be enough. Oh and by the way, the Palestinians are the ones responsible for most of the Palestinian deaths, not Israel. Palestinians really love to use their own non combatants as human shields.

And he supports the Palestinian State.

Even Israel does, in theory and eventually. Didn't you know?

and backs the Palestinians and other Muslim groups. Just as the quote implies.

It's still not a quote, cretin.

It is known that guns and weapons were being run through there to support Syrian Rebels aka ISIS aka OUR Enemy.

Yep, ISIS is armed with diverted and captured US weapons thanks to Shrub's stupidity, the insistence of Republicans like McCain and bipartisan repeats of historic failures while lefties were saying, "Don't do it." So?

ISIS is armed with American weapons because Obama didn't listen to Bush. Everything Bush said about totally pulling out was true. The buildup of ISIS all happened on Obama's watch from his inexperience in military tactics or governing. Remember Obama has never really had a job. Well he did as a Senator, but out of the 4 years he held the position, he only showed up for work 164 days.

Oh more name calling eh??? I'm not the coward here.

Still too cowardly to look up your nonquote and admit it's a lie. Still too stupid to remove it.

There's that quote thingy again

You're stuttering Vrede!!

No I'm not. You're illiterate.

Upset???

Hardly, you're adorable.

Then why do you support the agenda he is pushing???

Insisting on accurate quotation and sane criticisms is hardly supporting Obama's agenda. Try to make sense, really try.

More floundering!!

Do you want America, our Constitutional Republic (NOT A DEMOCRACY) to become a Socialist (sic) 3rd world Nation (sic), or be a super power (sic) that the world fears???

Non sequitur and too idiotic to know it.

Sounds like you're to scared to say!!!


Ah, you're an imperialist and fascist. Figures. Btw, no one "fears" illiterates like you, they're irrelevant.

Not an Imperialist or Fascist. Just one who has the upper hand over nations that may think of attacking the US in any way.

If you want Socialism (sic), I'm sure you will be welcomed in Canada or Europe.

Non sequitur and too idiotic to know it. You don't even have a clue what socialism is and isn't. For example, our biggest socialist institution is the Pentagon you're fawning over now. Didn't you know?

I know what Socialism and Communism is very well. You always study the enemies playbook.

My ancestors have been here since the 1560's, long before this was the united (sic) States. They have fought in every war since the Declaration of Independence was written, on the side of freedom and independence.

They probably fought to maintain the nonfreedom and non-independence of slavery.

They fought for the Confederacy. But instead of the Gubermint sponsored propaganda you were annointed with in school, you should really study it from the South's point of view.

None of America's wars since then, righteous or not, have been fights for American freedom and independence.

Really??? How so.

I will not let their sacrifices be in vain.

They would be ashamed of your consistent gullibility, illiteracy, foolishness, cowardice and lies. You dishonor them with every post.

Vrede opinions are like assholes, everybody has one. And yours is not that important.I believe my ancestors would support my stand for freedom from Despotism, Socialism and Communism.

That was fun. A long, rambling, nonsensical rant from Ragin Rebel ovinely parroting every Faux Noise talking point he can remember, all because he doesn't have the balls to admit that he's been duped by an imaginary quote for 2 years. Do it again.

At least Fox News is still on!!! Looks like CNN is gone, MSNBC and the other left leaning venues are losing all of their viewers. And there you go about that quote again.

[rstrong]

I challenge you to find ANYWHERE in our founding documents...The Declaration of Independence, our Constitution, or the Federalist papers where it says we are a democracy.

A democracy is a regime in which free elections regularly take place and a government that protects the rights of all. America is a democracy, or to be more precise a democratic republic, whether it's stated or not.

("Republic" just means that there's no monarch. Personally I'm a republican. While Canada's monarch is little more than ceremonial, I think that we should drop the monarchy on general principles.)

Yes, you elect representatives. America's founding fathers created a representative democracy because they were fearful of direct democracy. This is no different from Canada and most western democracies.

Yes, America has some non-democratic elements. Some of those have disappeared over time: Slavery was ended. Women got the vote. Senators became elected rather than appointed by state legislatures.

Most everything you - and often others - describe as somehow defining a republic, also exists in most every western democracy, including non-republics like Canada. Most if not all have a constitution, bill of rights or other body of law - or all three - to protect individual rights from the majority. The power comes first from the people. I could give plenty of examples of how Canada does a better job of "promoting Capitalism and not State-ism."

Meanwhile, the R in USSR (Soviet Union) and DDR (East Germany) and DPRK (North Korea) stands for "Republic." Iran is officially the "Islamic Republic of Iran."

[rstrong]

What Obama's policies do you disapprove of, that weren't Republican policy until Obama adopted them?

But we are looking at such as with Obamacare

ObamaCare is also known as "15 years of Republican health care policy until the moment Obama adopted it." I can get you plenty of citations from Republican/right-wing sources that back this up. It's a system that:

a) Mirrors the RomneyCare plan, lauded by Republicans as a private industry success. (It's only when Obama adopted it that it became a commie Marxist socialist failure.)

b) Is very similar to a proposal made to candidate McCain in 2008 by the Health Insurance lobby.

c) Is very similar to the Republican alternative to ClintonCare - the Republican's Health Equity and Access Reform Today Act of 1993.

d) Mirrors Bob Dole's plan from the 1990s.

Even the "individual mandate" was called for by Republicans for 15 years, by everyone from Bob Dole to Jim DeMint to the Heritage Foundation to Newt Gingrich to Mitt Romney, as the *alternative* to socialism. For Republicans the individual mandate was all about personal responsibility, by not forcing others to pay for your healthcare. (Now, of course, it's unconstitutional commie Marxist socialism.)

Whether you like the ACA or not, it's the Democrats adopting Republican policy.

We have had immigration laws in place since 1790. These laws have rules for potential immigrants to legally become Naturalized citizens.

America's founding fathers would never imagined how difficult it would be to legally become a naturalized citizen today. The vast majority of those immigrating in America's first 150 years would not qualify today. Nor would most of those illegal immigrants in today's cheap labor agriculture jobs.

Take a look at what it takes. I DARE YOU.

http://reason.com/assets/db/07cf533ddb1 ... 2ef5ad.jpg

With no citizen relatives in the US, and no college degree (which ag workers aren't going to have), "Sorry! There is virtually no process for unskilled immigrants without relations in the US to apply for permanent legal residence. Only 10,000 green cards are allotted every year, and the wait time approaches infinity."

Heck, even WITH a college degree, you have a shot IF you have a job offer AND IF your employer is willing to file the paperwork and pay up to $10,000 in legal fees AND IF your employer is willing to then wait six to ten years for the green card. AND THEN, after all that, you can get citizenship in another five or six years.

But over time and presidential administrations and pressure from special interests to create a cheap labor force, the enforcement of the rules and laws got slack,

Well sure. But again, there's no difference between Republicans and Democrats here. (Unless you count Obama's administration - despite claims to the contrary - sending back more illegal immigrants than previous administrations.)

Only worse because Obama chooses not to enforce the law.

Again, Obama's administration has been enforcing the law better than previous administrations.

But if you refer to his amnesty, keep in mind that it's the GOP that keeps pushing **for** amnesty.

Ronald Reagan's Immigration Reform and Control Act in 1986 granted amnesty to approximately 3 million illegal immigrants who entered the United States prior to January 1, 1982.

Reagan's "Shining House on the Hill" speech was about opening the borders to all.

Bush I followed up Reagan's amnesty with his own "Executive Amnesty". Reagan's 1985 executive amnesty took people who had been in the country for at least five years and put them on a path to legal status. But it did nothing for parents, children or spouses who didn’t qualify, even if someone else in the immediate family did. That created a scenario where families could be split up. When Congress failed to change the law, Bush did it on his own in 1990 under the banner of "family fairness." Obama's amnesty mirrors this one.

In 2003/2004 it was Bush II's turn to push for immigration amnesty. Almost half the Republicans in the US Senate were public supporters of AgJobs bill.

The Republican platform committee independently made immigration amnesty part of the Republican platform in 2004. (PDF. Refer to the "Supporting Humane and Legal Immigration" section.)

Bush II tried again in 2007. "Republican former President George W. Bush's effort to create a path to legal status for immigrants in the United States unlawfully failed in 2007"

In the 2008 election it was McCain that wanted immigration amnesty.

In July 2010 it was Sarah Palin's turn on the Bill O'Reilly show. Her plan was to make all illegal immigrants register. Those that don't would be found and deported. Those that DO register would be allowed to continue to work in the US.

Rick Perry wrote an op-ed in the newspaper saying that he was open to Amnesty. He's given speeches supporting an open border:

"We must say to every Texas child learning in a Texas classroom, “we don’t care where you come from, but where you are going, and we are going to do everything we can to help you get there.” And that vision must include the children of undocumented workers. "
[...]
"President Fox’s vision for an open border is a vision I embrace, as long as we demonstrate the will to address the obstacles to it."

In 2012 New Gingrich favored an amnesty for illegal immigrants who "may have earned the right to become legal." This was very similar to Obama's DREAM act.

Note: I had more citations, but the links keep dying.

Only now would I say that the Democrats are merely following Republican policy. Until now, it's the Republicans who have been much more pro-amnesty.

Sure a lot of RINO's have went astray

That's a cop-out, used by Ted Cruz types to turn gullible submorons against traditional Republicans.

With your examples, the RINOs would include at a minimum, Ronald Reagan, Bush I, Bush II, Newt Gingrich, Rick Perry, Sarah Palin, the Republican platform committee, and the half of the Republicans in the US Senate who voted for the AgJobs bill. And everyone from Bob Dole to Jim DeMint to the Heritage Foundation to Newt Gingrich to Mitt Romney who supported what later became ObamaCare.

One more time: What Obama policies do you disapprove of, that WERE NOT Republican policy until Obama adopted them?

[neoplacebo]

My favorite part of Rebel's rant is the one about ISIS. Apparently, he doesn't realize that ISIS wouldn't exist if it weren't for Shrub. Saddam would never put up with this shit. Opps!

[JTA]

The whole "The USA is not a Democracy but instead is a Constitutional Republic" debate is the same as when people jump on your case for calling the USA, "America", when everyone knows damn well you're talking about the USA when you say "America", and not Mexico or Canada or Brazil, which are also part of the "Americas". It's all semantics.

The purpose of language is to convey thoughts and concepts to others. So long as both parties know what you're talking about when you use a word that's all that matters. If we wanted to we could make up a brand new word of our own for the form of government the USA has. As long as everyone agreed on the concept that that word represents, then it would be just as valid as calling the USA a constitutional republic.

In the past the word democracy may have been used in reference to things we might call direct democracies nowadays, but the word has since evolved into a sort of umbrella term for any system of government where citizens have rights of suffrage.

There are tons of examples of words shifting meaning over time. This is how language works. I love etymology, it's so interesting.

[neoplacebo]

Ragin rebel is historically ignorant and doesn't realize it. Perhaps he will shoot off his legs while cleaning his guns and blame it on Obama. Who knows?

[Ragin Rebel]

My ancestors have been here since the 1560's, long before this was the united (sic) States. They have fought in every war since the Declaration of Independence was written, on the side of freedom and independence.

Your claim of a mistake on my part using lower case to write united is wrong. That is the way it is punctuated in our founding documents. So you are the one that is wrong. Learn some real history instead of depending on the public school system propaganda.

They probably fought to maintain the nonfreedom and non-independence of slavery.

First thing you have to remember is that those who were enslaved were sold to the British were their own people. You see black folks will trade about anything for some shiny "Bling". And at the time slavery was perfectly legal.

None of America's wars since then, righteous or not, have been fights for American freedom and independence.

The Civil war was not fought over slavery, but over, over taxation. The South at the time of the Civil War was responsible for 90+% of all revenues to the Federal Government. So if the North had allowed the legal succession of the South, the North would have soon failed, that is why Lincoln sent in Union troops in aggression to stop it. And had Lincoln not been assassinated, he would have shipped out all of the slaves. Here's a quote from "Honest Abe"; "I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races - that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race. I say upon this occasion I do not perceive that because the white man is to have the superior position the negro should be denied everything."


They fought for the Confederacy. But instead of the Gubermint sponsored propaganda you were annointed (sic) with in school, you should really study it from the South's point of view.

Really??? How so. (sic)

Tell us which war since the Civil War was about American freedom and independence. Good luck.

None really.

I know that Ragin Rebel shames his slaver-loving ancestors by running away, but since I stumbled on this:

I have not run anywhere. Some of us actually have to work, instead of stirring up shit on the internet all day long, to keep up the Parasites, useless eaters and breathers.

Do Wars Really Defend America’s Freedom?

[neoplacebo]

Ignorance gone to seed. Succession? You're the last person who should talk about grammar. And the Civil War was mostly about states rights, not taxes. Dumbass.

[neoplacebo]

I read the whole thing; it made me laugh when he ridiculed public schools and then can't spell what he thinks. Dumbass.

[O Really]

Ragin rebel is historically ignorant and doesn't realize it. Perhaps he will shoot off his legs while cleaning his guns and blame it on Obama. Who knows?

I think that would be "hysterically" ignorant.

[O Really]

Histrionically ignorant, too.

Your claim of a mistake on my part using lower case to write united is wrong. That is the way it is punctuated (sic, we're discussing capitalization, dummy) in our founding documents. So you are the one that is wrong. Learn some real history instead of depending on the public school system propaganda.

Apparently, every atlas, federal document and even Ragin Rebel's fellow cretins in the KKK are part of the conspiracy.

Or, he's just a sniveling wimp that doesn't even have the stones to admit a typo.

While we're at it, he should have had quotes since he used "united" as an object. And an apostrophe after "Ragin'" to indicate an implied letter. But grammar (or punctuation) is the least of Ragin Redneck's problems.

[rstrong]

Wrong document. Ragin specifically referred to the Declaration of Independence / the founding documents.

Thomas Jefferson's "original Rough draught" (June 1776) of the Declaration of Independence included the phrase "UNITED STATES OF AMERICA" in all caps in the headline.

But in the final Fourth of July version of the Declaration, the title was changed to read, "The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America".

The Constitution didn't come until over a decade later in 1787 - four years after America became an independent state - and was ratified a year after that.

[rstrong]

We were merely "thirteen united States", as you say.
[...]
Only a fool would claim that "united" is correct prose in 2014.

Going by the first statement, you're now the "fifty united States."

[Ragin Rebel]

I really have sympathy for you public Scrool System propagandized Liberals. As we all know, the winner writes the history, no matter how untrue it is.
Each State has always had the right to secede if they disagree with the central government or it's leaders, because they have become despotic or tyrannical.
And over taxation is despotic. The Federal government lost 90+% of it's revenue by the Southern States seceding. That is one reason the Civil War is also called the war of northern aggression.
I know you morons get off on belittling people, claiming a false sense of superiority, or trying to discredit folks. And here in Liberal La-La Land it's easy to pull off. But among REAL educated people, you would not fare so well. Believe what you want, because it's a terrible sight to see a Liberal finally find out what is the truth and what has been all Bull Shit pumped into your tiny minds for years.