Trump on Trial

[GoCubsGo]

They're taking the first amendment defense for a spin.

Don't think it's gonna go well.

[GoCubsGo]

Poor baby.

[Vrede too]

Let it out, Rudy, let it all out.

They're taking the first amendment defense for a spin.

Don't think it's gonna go well.

Agreed, inciting a riot and suborning other criminal activity like election tampering have always been 1A constraints. Excellent chance that even the extreme RW SCOTUS will say so if it gets so far.

[GoCubsGo]

Let it out, Rudy, let it all out.

They're taking the first amendment defense for a spin.

Don't think it's gonna go well.

Agreed, inciting a riot and suborning other criminal activity like election tampering has always been a 1A constraint.

They're going with the 1st amendment guarantees you can say anything anytime with no restrictions.

It'll change a few times before trial.

[GoCubsGo]

Also think they're going to try to relitigate the 2020 election.

Judge is not gonna have any of that just like Bannon's judge and they will kick, scream and cry.

[Whack9]

I feel like most of the dip shits that are saying the indictment has nothing substantial haven't actually read the indictment. I read through it last night and it seems pretty damning. Trump and co. weren't just making claims there were discrepancies and the election wasn't valid, they hatched a whole conspiracy to overturn it, and attempted said conspiracy despite being told on numerous occasions EVEN BY PEOPLE TRUMP APPOINTED HIMSELF that everything was sound and fair.

Yeah sure, you can speak whatever you want. Even falsehoods. But hatching an entire plan to send false electors to throw a wrench in the process and trying to get pence to go along with it, despite him and others saying it's not legal and the elections in each state were valid and there were no evidence of "cheating", is pretty damning in my opinion.

A former president ought to be held to higher standards. He was told on many occasions, even by people he himself appointed, and even by people loyal to him, that there was absolutely no evidence of any election fraud. Yet he still proceeded to claim the election was stolen

[GoCubsGo]

I feel like most of the dip shits that are saying the indictment has nothing substantial haven't actually read the indictment. I read through it last night and it seems pretty damning. Trump and co. weren't just making claims there were discrepancies and the election wasn't valid, they hatched a whole conspiracy to overturn it, and attempted said conspiracy despite being told on numerous occasions EVEN BY PEOPLE TRUMP APPOINTED HIMSELF that everything was sound and fair.

Yeah sure, you can speak whatever you want. Even falsehoods. But hatching an entire plan to send false electors to throw a wrench in the process and trying to get pence to go along with it, despite him and others saying it's not legal and the elections in each state were valid and there were no evidence of "cheating", is pretty damning in my opinion.

A former president ought to be held to higher standards. He was told on many occasions, even by people he himself appointed, and even by people loyal to him, that there was absolutely no evidence of any election fraud. Yet he still proceeded to claim the election was stolen

You're right on everything, but the problem that will arise is when the defense tries to litigate the law election and the judge says no you can't do that as those facts are established. The wingnuts will go around with their hair on fire about an unfair rigged trial even though it doesn't exonerate him from the actual charges.

[Whack9]

True.

It seems like they keep arguing semantics down to the subatomic level.

Next argument: "How can Trump conspire to steal an election when an election isn't even a physical entity that one can grab and run away with? Checkmate."

[GoCubsGo]

True.

It seems like they keep arguing semantics down to the subatomic level.

Next argument: "How can Trump conspire to steal an election when an election isn't even a physical entity that one can grab and run away with? Checkmate."

LOL

The Sovereign Citizens defense.

No worries, this is fluid and will change multiple times before trial. They'll keep throwing stuff against the wall in the hopes something will stick.

[Vrede too]

True.

It seems like they keep arguing semantics down to the subatomic level.

Next argument: "How can Trump conspire to steal an election when an election isn't even a physical entity that one can grab and run away with? Checkmate."

It will be dangerous pissing this judge off, both for TRE45QN and for risking attorney sanction.

The judge assigned to Trump's Jan. 6 case is a tough punisher of Capitol rioters

... Chutkan has often has handed down prison sentences in Jan. 6, 2021, riot cases that are harsher than Justice Department prosecutors recommended.

Chutkan has also ruled against Trump before in a separate Jan. 6 case. In November 2021, she refused his request to block the release of documents to the U.S. House’s Jan. 6 committee by asserting executive privilege.

She rejected his arguments that he could hold privilege over documents from his administration even after President Joe Biden had cleared the way for the National Archives to turn the papers over. She wrote that Trump could not claim his privilege “exists in perpetuity.”

In a memorable line from her ruling, Chutkan wrote, “Presidents are not kings, and Plaintiff is not President.”

... “Every day we’re hearing about reports of anti-democratic factions of people plotting violence, the potential threat of violence, in 2024,” she said in December 2021 before sentencing a Florida man who attacked police officers to more than five years behind bars. At the time, that sentence was the longest for a Jan. 6 case.

“It has to be made clear that trying to violently overthrow the government, trying to stop the peaceful transition of power and assaulting law enforcement officers in that effort is going to be met with absolutely certain punishment,” she said.

Judge Trevor McFadden, a Trump nominee, suggested during a hearing in 2021 that the Justice Department was being too hard on those who broke into the Capitol compared with the people arrested during racial injustice protests following George Floyd’s 2020 murder.

Without naming her colleague, Chutkan criticized McFadden’s suggestion days later.

“People gathered all over the country last year to protest the violent murder by the police of an unarmed man. Some of those protesters became violent,” Chutkan said during an October 2021 hearing.

“But to compare the actions of people protesting, mostly peacefully, for civil rights, to those of a violent mob seeking to overthrow the lawfully elected government is a false equivalency and ignores a very real danger that the Jan. 6 riot posed to the foundation of our democracy.”

Bazinga!

[Vrede too]

Also think they're going to try to relitigate the 2020 election.

Judge is not gonna have any of that just like Bannon's judge and they will kick, scream and cry.

https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1686552658230890496

Turnabout's fair play. Alvin Bragg is casting his nets even further back than that.

Trump's rape trial deposition comes back to haunt him in Manhattan hush-money case

Opps.

[Vrede too]

I think the "undicted co-conspirators" refer to those who flipped and are now also referred to as "canaries"

I think some still have the choice to make.

'Conspiracy... beamed down from the mothership': CNN identifies Trump co-conspirator six

Not long after United States Justice Department special counsel Jack Smith indicted former President Donald Trump on four counts for trying to overturn the results of the 2020 election, CNN's Katelyn Polantz confirmed the identities of five of the unnamed co-conspirators that were included in Smith's criminal complaint.

Those people are Rudy Giuliani, John Eastman, Sidney Powell, Jeffrey Clark, and Kenneth Chesbro — all of whom were attorneys advising Defendant Trump at the time.

Then, on Tuesday's edition of Out Front with Erin Burnett, Polantz reported that "we are now learning that the senior campaign adviser who is signified in this indictment as one of the people who was giving Trump the harshest assessment that there was no fraud after the election that would overturn the vote, that person is Jason Miller."

... According to the federal filing, Miller warned Trump that "when our research and campaign legal team can't back up any of the claims made by our Elite Strike Force Legal Team, you can see why we are 0-32 on our cases. I'll obviously hustle to help on all fronts, but it's tough to own any of this when it's all just conspiracy sh*t beamed down from the mothership."

[Whack9]

It's really interesting (and scary) reading responses to Trumps indictment by leaders and news media that support him. I seem to recall that in the past excuses would at least be somewhat believable. Now it's all straight falsehoods or blatant omissions. The indictment is really easy reading. But most supporters won't crack it open. Hence the reason it's so easy for these people to spread falsehoods.

[Whack9]

If I ever get a parking ticket I'm gonna announce my candidacy for President of the United States and declare election interference.

[billy.pilgrim]

If I ever get a parking ticket I'm gonna announce my candidacy for President of the United States and declare election interference.

Never concede

[Vrede too]

If I ever get a parking ticket I'm gonna announce my candidacy for President of the United States and declare election interference.

The lawlessness of this persecution of Whack9 is reminiscent of Nazi Germany in the 1930s, the former Soviet Union, and other authoritarian, dictatorial regimes. Whack9 has always followed the law and the Constitution, with advice from many highly accomplished parking law attorneys.

Never concede

[GoCubsGo]

I think the "undicted co-conspirators" refer to those who flipped and are now also referred to as "canaries"

I think some still have the choice to make.

'Conspiracy... beamed down from the mothership': CNN identifies Trump co-conspirator six

Not long after United States Justice Department special counsel Jack Smith indicted former President Donald Trump on four counts for trying to overturn the results of the 2020 election, CNN's Katelyn Polantz confirmed the identities of five of the unnamed co-conspirators that were included in Smith's criminal complaint.

Those people are Rudy Giuliani, John Eastman, Sidney Powell, Jeffrey Clark, and Kenneth Chesbro — all of whom were attorneys advising Defendant Trump at the time.

Then, on Tuesday's edition of Out Front with Erin Burnett, Polantz reported that "we are now learning that the senior campaign adviser who is signified in this indictment as one of the people who was giving Trump the harshest assessment that there was no fraud after the election that would overturn the vote, that person is Jason Miller."

... According to the federal filing, Miller warned Trump that "when our research and campaign legal team can't back up any of the claims made by our Elite Strike Force Legal Team, you can see why we are 0-32 on our cases. I'll obviously hustle to help on all fronts, but it's tough to own any of this when it's all just conspiracy sh*t beamed down from the mothership."

I was hoping for the other Miller. Hard to believe he's unscathed.

[GoCubsGo]

FWIW, the twitterverse seems to think Ginni Thomas could be #6.
I'd be ok with that too.

https://twitter.com/search?q=%22Ginni%2 ... cal=trends

[GoCubsGo]

The boys are definitely hanging a tad lower.

[Vrede too]

I was hoping for the other Miller. Hard to believe he's unscathed.

Stephen was involved hip deep with the fake electors and J6:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_M ... nistration
Maybe there's more to come than what is implied by the first indictment.