Mass Shootings

Generally an unmoderated forum for discussion of pretty much any topic. The focus however, is usually politics.
Post Reply
User avatar
GoCubsGo
Vice admiral
Posts: 11263
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:22 am

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by GoCubsGo »

Vrede too wrote:
Mon Jul 18, 2022 6:50 pm

There were also 27 US Marshals and DHS LEOs there.

:obscene-birdiered:
Almost 400 of them and not a good guy amongst them.
Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

User avatar
O Really
Admiral
Posts: 18000
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 3:37 pm

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by O Really »

Not saying it wasn't a reasonable first approach, but I found the contrast between what the Uvalde cops said and how they said it to their shooter ("Please drop you weapon sir, nobody else needs to be hurt...") and how it goes with Black guys walking their dogs in white neighbourhoods ("Get on the ground muhfucker - get on the ground - now!")

User avatar
GoCubsGo
Vice admiral
Posts: 11263
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:22 am

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by GoCubsGo »

O Really wrote:
Mon Jul 18, 2022 7:37 pm
Not saying it wasn't a reasonable first approach, but I found the contrast between what the Uvalde cops said and how they said it to their shooter ("Please drop you weapon sir, nobody else needs to be hurt...") and how it goes with Black guys walking their dogs in white neighbourhoods ("Get on the ground muhfucker - get on the ground - now!")
Additionally, you had an equalizer with an AR15.
Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

User avatar
Vrede too
Superstar Cultmaster
Posts: 40355
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:46 am
Location: Hendersonville, NC

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by Vrede too »

GoCubsGo wrote:
Mon Jul 18, 2022 7:20 pm
Vrede too wrote:
Mon Jul 18, 2022 6:50 pm

There were also 27 US Marshals and DHS LEOs there.

:obscene-birdiered:
Almost 400 of them and not a good guy amongst them.
They would have needed only one Elisjsha Dicken, 22, of Seymour, Ind.
Elisjsha Dicken: Good Samaritan Named in Greenwood Mall Shooting

Image

The gunman, named by the Marion County coroner as Jonathan Sapirman, 20, of Greenwood, was shot and killed at the scene by Dicken, who took action only two minutes into the rampage....

You can read more about Sapirman’s troubled background here.

... Dicken was carrying the gun lawfully under the state’s new constitutional carry law, police said, although the mall had a policy of not allowing weapons on its property.
Technically, he was trespassing. I doubt that he'll be charged.
... Mayor Mark Myers wrote that police had confirmed that four people died and two were injured, including a 12-year-old girl who suffered minor injuries. The four deaths include the shooter. The deceased victims were named by Marion County and Johnson County coroners as Pedro Pineda, 56, of Indianapolis; Rosa Mirian Rivera de Pineda, 37, of Indianapolis; and Victor Gomez, 30, of Indianapolis. The Pinedas were husband and wife.
Coincidence that they're all Latino?
... Police recovered 24 rifle rounds fired by the suspect and 10 handgun rounds fired by Dicken.

... On Facebook, Dicken says he lives in Columbus, Indiana, and went to CSA New Tech for high school.

In 2014, he shared a picture of an armed military member with a caption that read, “The reason terrorists can’t sleep at night. And the reason you can.” However, most of his posts are just about friends or Call of Duty and Minecraft.

He also shared a post that read, “Arms are the only true badge of liberty.”

In 2013, Dicken also shared a photo of a young girl with a gun with a caption that reads, “Teach your daughters to shoot, because a restraining order is just a piece of paper. Share if you believe women should be able to protect themselves.”
:shock: He would have been only 13.
He also shared a graphic that reads, “Dear God, why do you allow so much violence in schools? Signed a concerned student. Dear concerned student, I’m not allowed in schools. God.” ...
:roll:

Great minds :wave: :
4. Dicken Is Being Praised as a Hero on Social Media as Well, With People Contrasting His Quick Actions to the Inaction in Uvalde, Texas ...
"When you can make people believe (sheer batshittery), you can make them commit atrocities."
-- Voltaire
1312.

User avatar
Vrede too
Superstar Cultmaster
Posts: 40355
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:46 am
Location: Hendersonville, NC

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by Vrede too »

GoCubsGo wrote:
Sat Jul 16, 2022 10:59 pm
Vrede too wrote:
Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:38 pm
It's rough :( . Disease patients can stay critical for a long time, as with Covid. It's touchier with trauma/surgical patients - infections, blood disorders, strokes, hypoxic brain injury, other organs failing, etc. Kids are both resilient and vulnerable, depending.
No Cooper update today.

That's not encouraging.
I saw a headline about slight improvement, didn't open the article. On right now, just began at 9:10 PM:
Highland Park Mayor Testifies on Access to Assault Weapons
New

9:00 PM EDT CSPAN2

Nancy Rotering, mayor of Highland Park, Ill., which was the site of a mass shooting on Independence Day, testifies on civilian access to military-style assault weapons before the Senate Judiciary Committee.
Sen Dick Durbin (D-IL):
83 shots in less than 60 seconds. Used three 30-round magazines.
309 mass shootings this year, 47 since July 4.

Sen Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa):
Deflecting from guns, discussing mental health, threat assessment and early intervention. Okay, where's the money, RepuQs, and will we stop arming these threats? I can't watch, maybe I'll check in later.
"When you can make people believe (sheer batshittery), you can make them commit atrocities."
-- Voltaire
1312.

User avatar
GoCubsGo
Vice admiral
Posts: 11263
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:22 am

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by GoCubsGo »

Vrede too wrote:
Wed Jul 20, 2022 9:11 pm

I saw a headline about slight improvement, didn't open the article. On right now, just began at 9:10 PM:
Highland Park Mayor Testifies on Access to Assault Weapons
New

He's somewhat improved, breathing on his own and the fever broke.🤞🤞🤞

https://www.foxnews.com/us/highland-par ... yptr=yahoo

Nancy Rotering testified this afternoon, she was pretty good but seemed a little rushed from the bits I caught.
Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

User avatar
Vrede too
Superstar Cultmaster
Posts: 40355
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:46 am
Location: Hendersonville, NC

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by Vrede too »

GoCubsGo wrote:
Wed Jul 20, 2022 10:06 pm
He's somewhat improved, breathing on his own and the fever broke.🤞🤞🤞

https://www.foxnews.com/us/highland-par ... ury-family

Nancy Rotering testified this afternoon, she was pretty good but seemed a little rushed from the bits I caught.
Best wishes for Cooper.

She just came on. I almost changed the channel again while this asshole was on:
User Clip: NAAGA President Philip T. Smith Testifies at the Senate Hearings: July 20, 2022

Protecting Our Community from Mass Shootings: President Philip T. Smith was invited to testify before the US Senate on Wednesday, July 20, 2022. He presented his case of why Black Americans should have the right to own firearms. Additionally, he states that all US citizens should have that right and by banning firearms, we are left unprotected. Those who wish to harm law-abiding citizens will always have access to tools (firearms or otherwise) that can be used to hurt us. The problem is the person, not the weapon. President Smith also clarifies the misconceptions of the AR-15.
National African American Gun Association

Wow, Mayor Rotering was rushed and Sen John Cornyn (R-TX) is questioning NAAGA Smith. :roll: Channel changed. If I was a Highland Parker I would have gotten booted from the hearing an hour ago.

Edit: Great minds . . . I just found this -
Parkland survivor David Hogg was kicked out of a House gun control meeting after tearing into Rep. Andy Biggs for using the same logic of 'mass shooters in your manifesto'

... During the meeting, Biggs, a Republican from Arizona, claimed Americans, specifically residents of his state, need assault weapons to protect themselves against an "invasion" of undocumented migrants, whom the conservative lawmaker said posed "a danger or threat."

"The reality is it is an invasion of our southern border," Biggs said.

Biggs' remarks prompted Hogg to rise from his seat in the gallery and yell: "You're reiterating the points of mass shooters in your manifesto!"

"The shooter at my high school: antisemitic, anti-Black, and racist. The shooter in El Paso described it as an invasion," the gun control activist shouted at Biggs during the meeting, referring to a 2019 shooting at a Walmart store in El Paso, Texas.

"Guess what? Those guns are coming from the United States of America. They aren't coming from Mexico," he added as security escorted him from the committee room. "You are reiterating the points of a mass shooter, sir. You are perpetuating violence." ...
Racist ammosexuals from Arizona should be interrupted.

Edit: She's back, being questioned by Sen Klobuchar. Got applause at least twice. Now Ted Cruz's turn. Whining. Channel changed.
"When you can make people believe (sheer batshittery), you can make them commit atrocities."
-- Voltaire
1312.

User avatar
GoCubsGo
Vice admiral
Posts: 11263
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:22 am

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by GoCubsGo »

The United States is de evolving. Teachers with three days of training are the best solution.

More guns please.

Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

User avatar
GoCubsGo
Vice admiral
Posts: 11263
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:22 am

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by GoCubsGo »

Vrede too wrote:
Wed Jul 20, 2022 10:23 pm

Best wishes for Cooper.

👍👍🤞🤞
Cooper update: He has continued to make progress this week. As a result, after almost a month in the pediatric intensive care unit (PICU), Cooper was transferred out of the PICU to a general floor in the hospital.

Below are additional updates:

He is no longer in critical condition.

His collapsed lung continues to heal, and he is breathing on his own.

He has been fever free most of this week.

He was able to eat solid food for the first time! One of his favorites, mac-and-cheese.

He was able to visit the playroom in the hospital several times this week.

He is currently working to be medically cleared and deemed stable enough for transport so that he can be transferred to the Shirley Ryan Ability Lab where he will continue the long road of recovery (physically, mentally, and emotionally) that is ahead of him.

Thank you for all the donations to GoFundMe.

If you or an entity you are aware of would rather donate to a 501(c)(3) organization, please contact the GoFundMe organizer via email and we can provide you with information on how to do so.

The family continues to feel all the prayers being sent their way and are grateful for and humbled by the outpouring of support as they begin to process what will be needed for Cooper when he eventually is able to return home.

I will leave you with a statement from their mother, Keely: “Please keep following along and praying for Cooper and for Luke. They are good, sweet boys who love everyone and want good for everyone they know. They believe in the best in people and in the world. Their lives are so much more and better than this terrible thing than was done to them. Their lives are not a tragedy, they are a triumph.”
Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

User avatar
Vrede too
Superstar Cultmaster
Posts: 40355
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:46 am
Location: Hendersonville, NC

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by Vrede too »

:clap: :clap: HP Strong.
"When you can make people believe (sheer batshittery), you can make them commit atrocities."
-- Voltaire
1312.

User avatar
Vrede too
Superstar Cultmaster
Posts: 40355
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:46 am
Location: Hendersonville, NC

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by Vrede too »

GoCubsGo wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 9:34 am
The United States is de evolving. Teachers with three days of training are the best solution.

More guns please.
Do teachers ever have disputes over parking? Oh wait:

Image
The Parking Spot Escalation

Good thing they didn't have Penny's guns.

PARKING FEUD Two killed and six injured in horror mass shooting outside home when neighbor ‘opened fire over blocked driveway’

"used a high-power rifle ... fired 30 to 40 rounds ... Police entered the shooter's home where they found 11 weapons "strategically placed throughout," cops said."

Parking.
"When you can make people believe (sheer batshittery), you can make them commit atrocities."
-- Voltaire
1312.

User avatar
GoCubsGo
Vice admiral
Posts: 11263
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:22 am

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by GoCubsGo »

Leading the way in education. :roll:

The irony is Madison County is so sparsely populated that the only one that may want to shoot up a school is one of their own.

Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

User avatar
O Really
Admiral
Posts: 18000
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 3:37 pm

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by O Really »

As neoplacebo might say, Sweet Jesus in a bucket. What could possibly go wrong?

User avatar
GoCubsGo
Vice admiral
Posts: 11263
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:22 am

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by GoCubsGo »

O Really wrote:
Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:35 am
As neoplacebo might say, Sweet Jesus in a bucket. What could possibly go wrong?
:lol: He would say just that!
Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

User avatar
Vrede too
Superstar Cultmaster
Posts: 40355
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:46 am
Location: Hendersonville, NC

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by Vrede too »

GoCubsGo wrote:
Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:45 am
O Really wrote:
Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:35 am
As neoplacebo might say, Sweet Jesus in a bucket. What could possibly go wrong?
:lol: He would say just that!
Otoh, a Vrede too might say:
Vrede too wrote:
Fri Aug 05, 2022 6:16 pm
... Everything the modern terrorist needs. National news :puke-left: . What could possibly go wrong? 2 years ago in TN: ...
viewtopic.php?p=172592#p172592

:P :wave:
"When you can make people believe (sheer batshittery), you can make them commit atrocities."
-- Voltaire
1312.

User avatar
O Really
Admiral
Posts: 18000
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 3:37 pm

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by O Really »

Schools in US: 130,930
Elementary schools: 87,498
Secondary schools: 26,727
Combined schools: 15,804
Other: 901

In the last 20 years, there have been 68 school shootings, although frequency is increasing. In any case, the odds of a shooting happening at a given school are extremely low. But there are other security issues that are more likely, mostly angry parents, and obviously you don't want a bunch of people just wandering in and around. Problem with the schools is that they put too much effort into defence once the shooter is in and not nearly enough just keeping the shooter out in the first place. How many recent shooters have entered by climbing/cutting fences or rushing a security gate or blasting locked doors? I think that would be none. How many walked in past non- or poorly-guarded unlocked doors? I think that would be pretty much all of them.

So what do people who actually know something about security for places facing much higher risks than schools do? Start with a perimeter - a decent fence with a single-entrance guarded gate. F'rinstance:
Image

Secondly, perimeter and door access monitoring. Way back in the day, military posts used sentries. Cameras and monitors are better. Electronic tampering alarms add another layer.

Expensive, sure, but practical, possible, and effective. It could be argued that not one of the shootings by anyone other than a current student would have occurred with proper security, and that with metal detectors the current students couldn't have gotten in with their guns.

But sure, nevermind what has been proven effective by everybody from military operations to power companies to private corporations - just buy them some AR-15's and stick your head up your ass. Right.

User avatar
GoCubsGo
Vice admiral
Posts: 11263
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:22 am

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by GoCubsGo »

Vrede too wrote:
Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:52 am


:P :wave:
:oops: :doh:
Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

User avatar
GoCubsGo
Vice admiral
Posts: 11263
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:22 am

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by GoCubsGo »

O Really wrote:
Sat Aug 06, 2022 12:25 pm

Expensive, sure, but practical, possible, and effective. It could be argued that not one of the shootings by anyone other than a current student would have occurred with proper security, and that with metal detectors the current students couldn't have gotten in with their guns.

Or, just get rid of the guns access.

Schools, nightclubs, parades etc. can all be safe.
Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

User avatar
O Really
Admiral
Posts: 18000
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 3:37 pm

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by O Really »

GoCubsGo wrote:
Sat Aug 06, 2022 12:35 pm
O Really wrote:
Sat Aug 06, 2022 12:25 pm

Expensive, sure, but practical, possible, and effective. It could be argued that not one of the shootings by anyone other than a current student would have occurred with proper security, and that with metal detectors the current students couldn't have gotten in with their guns.

Or, just get rid of the guns access.

Schools, nightclubs, parades etc. can all be safe.
Of course. But nagonnahappen.

User avatar
Vrede too
Superstar Cultmaster
Posts: 40355
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:46 am
Location: Hendersonville, NC

Re: Mass Shootings

Unread post by Vrede too »

O Really wrote:
Sat Aug 06, 2022 12:25 pm
Schools in US: 130,930 ...
The average price for an AR-15 is about $850. That would be $111,290,500 to put one in each school. Hmmm, think that might have something to do with the strategy?
... How many recent shooters have entered by ... blasting locked doors? ...
Sandy Hook Elementary.

As for the rest, I don't agree with the even more expensive Rx of turning all schools into prisons in order to try to prevent rare school shootings. First, the shooters are often students or former students. They've had years to ID any weaknesses. Then, an unlikely perfectly secure school would just lead to targeting school buses, pickup or drop off, sporting events, Sunday schools, carnivals, parks, malls, birthday parties or any other place kids gather. No lives get saved.
GoCubsGo wrote:
Sat Aug 06, 2022 12:35 pm
O Really wrote:
Sat Aug 06, 2022 12:25 pm

Expensive, sure, but practical, possible, and effective. It could be argued that not one of the shootings by anyone other than a current student would have occurred with proper security, and that with metal detectors the current students couldn't have gotten in with their guns.

Or, just get rid of the guns access.

Schools, nightclubs, parades etc. can all be safe.
:thumbup:
"When you can make people believe (sheer batshittery), you can make them commit atrocities."
-- Voltaire
1312.

Post Reply