Race, lets make this serious! It is nearly 2013.

[Vrede too]

Fine, but a random lack of bias in high profile cases should lead to a darker than expected jury as often as it lead to a lighter than expected jury. I can't think of any instances where that's occurred.

Not if you've got only 13% or so darker potential jurors to start with. (You don't have to do it, for real) Take 100 coins, 85 of them nickels; 15 pennies. Flip the coins for juror selection. You'll rarely get a majority pennies and only occasionally get as high as 25%.

I don't expect majority pennies in a majority nickel test, but I would expect more than 15 pennies as often as less than 15 pennies.

[neoplacebo]

Ah, I thought that you were saying that reality matches the theory of colorblind fairness.

Nope.
But I do agree that it's not necessary to have a jury that looks like the defendant in order to give a fair trial. However, there are some instances in which the jury needs to understand the circumstances surrounding what the defendant did in order to judge the crime - and sometimes it would help to be of the same race. F'rinstance, a white person might not understand why a black person immediately ran from the police if he wasn't guilty. A black person might not understand why a white person picked up a weapon when he saw the black person pass by his car. The answer to both is racially based fear. But it's still better to have a mix of people in the jury.

Your comment about whites not understanding why a black person would run from the police is something I witnessed myself today while watching some of the Ahmaud Arbery trial. The young McMichaels was on the stand and described "chasing" Arbery in his truck (at walking or jogging speed) and yelling at him to stop. Arbery reversed direction no less than three times trying to avoid McMichaels but him and his dad kept following him. Granted, those crackers weren't the police but I bet Arbery knew they were crackers.

[neoplacebo]

Yeah, most people think "jury of peers" means you get a group like yourself. Originally it was to make sure the rich people weren't judged by the hoi polloi or the great unwashed.

No doubt about it. The concept of a jury of your peers could theoretically be taken to the extreme.....like ugly people getting ugly jurors or fat people getting fat jurors. There'd just be no end to it. I personally now and again am judged by a jury of my beers. Most times it results in a mistrial, but without prejudice so I am able to go on the next trial with little trouble.

[billy.pilgrim]

Good quick read here

https://johnpavlovitz.com/2021/11/10/fo ... ed-racist/

[Vrede too]

Good quick read here

https://johnpavlovitz.com/2021/11/10/fo ... ed-racist/

Thanks!

... If you’re truly offended at the assertion that you might be a white supremacist—ask yourself whether sharing a voting block with The Proud Boys, the KKK, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Madison Cawthorn, Paul Gosar, Lauren Boebert, Stephen Miller, Steve Bannon, and BlueLivesMatter is a convincing rebuttal or a strong case for the prosecution.

You are known by the company you keep, by the people you vote for, those you contribute to and elevate to public office and the highest courts of this nation. And if your self-righteous outrage at being labeled a racist is real, you’re going to need to explain how you can be someone who honestly treasures diversity—and stands alongside its greatest and fiercest adversaries....

Gaetz needs to start trying harder. Even a tour with Marjorie Taylor Greene WTF? wasn't enough to make the list.

[Vrede too]

Jury finds men guilty of murdering Ahmaud Arbery

A Georgia jury decided Wednesday to convict the three white men accused of murdering 25-year-old Ahmaud Arbery, an unarmed Black jogger.

Father and son Gregory and Travis McMichael and their neighbor William “Roddie” Bryan each faced nine felony charges during the trial. All defendants face a minimum sentence of life in prison.

Travis McMichael, the only one found guilty of malice murder, was convicted on all nine counts, which included felony murder, aggravated assault, false imprisonment and criminal attempt to commit felony.

Gregory McMichael was found not guilty of malice murder, but guilty on the other eight counts. Malice murder refers to when a person “unlawfully and with malice aforethought, either expressed or implied, causes the death of another human being.”

Bryan, the neighbor who took the video of the shooting and helped entrap Arbery, was found guilty of three counts of felony murder and one count each of aggravated assault, false imprisonment and criminal attempt to commit a felony. He was acquitted on the other charges.

Now, go after the cops and prosecutors that tried to cover up the MURDER and delayed investigation for months.

... The killing of Arbery on Feb. 23, 2020, initially fell under the radar but drew national attention after a video of the killing was released that May....

Although Arbery was killed in February, Bryan and the McMichaels were not arrested until May, after the video was posted online, sparking public outcry.

The actions of law enforcement and local prosecutors came under scrutiny in the aftermath of the video’s release. Gregory McMichael is a former Glynn County police officer, and two prosecutors recused themselves from the case due to conflicts of interest....

Accessories after the fact.

[neoplacebo]

Yep. Good business. And the good ol boy aspect of it reeks of wtf. The federal charges are still to be tried; maybe the ancillary issue of how it was initially investigated will come up then. That's what I'd do if I were prosecuting and not in a coma.

[Vrede too]

Yep. Good business. And the good ol boy aspect of it reeks of wtf. The federal charges are still to be tried; maybe the ancillary issue of how it was initially investigated will come up then. That's what I'd do if I were prosecuting and not in a coma.

Q: What is the predictable musical result from lizard stomping?

A: Coma Coma Coma Coma Coma Chameleon.

[billy.pilgrim]

Yep. Good business. And the good ol boy aspect of it reeks of wtf. The federal charges are still to be tried; maybe the ancillary issue of how it was initially investigated will come up then. That's what I'd do if I were prosecuting and not in a coma.

Q: What is the predictable musical result from lizard stomping?

A: Coma Coma Coma Coma Coma Chameleon.

According to his childhood friend Bif,
boy jesus could fix 'em

[Vrede too]

Yep. Good business. And the good ol boy aspect of it reeks of wtf. The federal charges are still to be tried; maybe the ancillary issue of how it was initially investigated will come up then. That's what I'd do if I were prosecuting and not in a coma.

Q: What is the predictable musical result from lizard stomping?

A: Coma Coma Coma Coma Coma Chameleon.

According to his childhood friend Bif,
boy jesus could fix 'em

neoplacebo is biblical and eternal.
viewtopic.php?p=144541#p144541

[billy.pilgrim]

Yep. Good business. And the good ol boy aspect of it reeks of wtf. The federal charges are still to be tried; maybe the ancillary issue of how it was initially investigated will come up then. That's what I'd do if I were prosecuting and not in a coma.

Q: What is the predictable musical result from lizard stomping?

A: Coma Coma Coma Coma Coma Chameleon.

According to his childhood friend Bif,
boy jesus could fix 'em

neoplacebo is biblical and eternal.
viewtopic.php?p=144541#p144541

Y'all should read Lamb, or any of Christopher Moore's books

[Ulysses]

As far as I know, Jesus never stomped on anything.

Neo is no Jesus.

[neoplacebo]

Yep. Good business. And the good ol boy aspect of it reeks of wtf. The federal charges are still to be tried; maybe the ancillary issue of how it was initially investigated will come up then. That's what I'd do if I were prosecuting and not in a coma.

Q: What is the predictable musical result from lizard stomping?

A: Coma Coma Coma Coma Coma Chameleon.

According to his childhood friend Bif,
boy jesus could fix 'em

neoplacebo is biblical and eternal.
viewtopic.php?p=144541#p144541

I was at one time an associate Jesus...raised a lizard now and again but usually re stomped them within minutes.

[neoplacebo]

As far as I know, Jesus never stomped on anything.

Neo is no Jesus.

Goddamnit, comma, I was only an associate Jesus. I had to resign for faulty wipers and bad language.

[Vrede too]

According to his childhood friend Bif,
boy jesus could fix 'em

neoplacebo is biblical and eternal.
viewtopic.php?p=144541#p144541

As far as I know, Jesus never stomped on anything.

Neo is no Jesus.

You fail comprehension again. The lizard squasher is Jesus' younger brother. Jesus brings them back to life. Everyone knows this.

[Ulysses]

As far as I know, Jesus never stomped on anything.

Neo is no Jesus.

Goddamnit, comma, I was only an associate Jesus. I had to resign for faulty wipers and bad language.

Faulty wipers?

No wonder your posts stink.

[Vrede too]

Goddamnit, comma, I was only an associate Jesus. I had to resign for faulty wipers and bad language.

Faulty wipers?

No wonder your posts stink.

neoplacebo, Useless is obsessing about your ass, again. Nttawwt.

[neoplacebo]

Sigh; it's a rather uncommon characteristic of SAHM's. All you can do is pretend it didn't happen and go on down the hall.

[O Really]

Good verdict in Arbery case. If that prosecutor had had Rittenhouse the Rittenhouse case, he'd have gone down for something. I've read a variety of analyses and comments on Rittenhouse, and offer the following of my own:
1. Rittenhouse had very good lawyers; the prosecutor was clearly outlawyered with OJ-worthy tactics.
2. The prosecutor was probably over-confident to start with, and skimped on preparation.
3. The prosecutor focused to much on the murder parts and neglected to work on potential other things Rittenhouse could be convicted of.
4. If you look at the way the defence forced focus only on the moment Rittenhouse shot and fuzzed out all the background, you could see how a "self-defence" claim could be believable. Of course, nothing happens in a vacuum, but making it so was part of the out-lawyering. Force the jury to look at it from your perspective and ignore the elephant.
5. But consider - you've got a 17-year old kid, travels to and attends a demonstration while carrying around an AR-15 type rifle, being there for the stated purpose of "protecting property" of people he had no relation to or stores he didn't even shop in, gets into confrontations, scares others with his gun-waving, shoots three people, and runs off. And the prosecution couldn't find ANYTHING they could convict him of? No firearms violation? No "going armed to the terror of the people"? No reckless discharge of firearm? No parking violation? Nothing? Wisconsin gun laws are pretty lax, but even so, it looks like a 17-year old can't carry a rifle much of anywhere except target shooting and hunting. Oh yeah, I guess they dropped that charge because he was hunting.

Oh well, maybe he'll be tied up in civil litigation for as long as OJ was.

[Ulysses]

Plus there's that conservative asshole of a Judge Schroeder.

I suspect the R's banded together, perhaps nationwide, to bankroll a top notch defense for Kylie, while the city prosecutor was making do with a limited budget, staff, and prep.

It just goes to show, in America and probably most of the world, money is power, even in a courtroom.

I suspect this victory may go to Kylie's head, and he might, at some point in the future, wind up committing even more heinous crimes that no amount of politically inspired funding can help him avoid a conviction.

Plus there's all the civil suits likely to come next. Eventually Kylie's fairy godmothers will tire of propping up his sorry ass. Aren't they already squabbling over who gets to keep the bail money?