Car Trouble Thread

[rstrong]

Sounds like our GAO.....you remember the $500 toilet seats and the $300 hammers....... :-0?>

I recall reading about the toilet seats. They were replacements for an aircraft, not something you could buy off the shelf.

The contractor had no problem defending the cost. Something to the effect of "It's not really $500 per seat. It's $20,000 for the first seat - the cost of retooling the factory to produce the seat, plus the cost of the legal paperwork needed to fulfill the contract. The rest of the seats we're throwing in for free."

I'd like to hear how many hammers they were buying. If it's anything like out military, they probably only bought ten. But still, the costs of people who specialize in bidding on military contracts needs to be added. Plus the cost of an engineer to certify that the hammer meets the specifications - which may require investigating exactly what metals were used - because you have to KNOW, not assume, that it meets the specs. Plus people to handle all the paperwork involved and the usual costs of running the business. All of which have to be spread out across just ten hammers.

[O Really]

Yes, various parts of the government, including the military, buy huge amounts of stuff off the shelf, and when they get something custom or semi-custom made, they beat the hell out of the bidders. But there's a good reason the federal specifications for chocolate chip cookies are 100 pages. Here's why: when the government buys something, it's usually in large quantities, creating contracts that a very lucrative for providers and getting these contracts can be life or death for the company. So with everybody wanting to get the contract, they can't just award it to the purchasing guy's brother in law. They have to set rules, or large number of us taxpaying citizens would scream. But bidders know that lowest qualified bid will win so - surprise - they try to cut corners. So the original spec says "chocolate chip cookies" but because somebody was trying to get by with having only one chip per cookie, an additional spec says each cookie must have a minimum of 3 chips. Then because some bidders find flour cheaper in China, an additional spec requires US-produced flour. And because some bidder tried to cut costs on packaging, resulting in cases of chips getting crushed and broken, additional specs define how the cookies must be packaged, how many can be stacked in a case, what in-bag protection is included, and how they'll be protected from moisture. And yada and yada. Pretty soon you've got a hundred pages of specs, and whose fault is that? It's "us"...those of us who want the contracts, and those of us who would scream if the process isn't objective and open to all. Does anybody really believe the purchasing guy wouldn't find it easier just to order up 10,000 cases of his own favorite brand?

[Mr.B]

F-35 Program cost increases and delays

The styrofoam had to have the lowest qualified bid...

[O Really]

F-35 Program cost increases and delays

The styrofoam had to have the lowest qualified bid...

Yeah, part of the problem with a "lowest bid" mentality. Lockheed was the lowest bidder and now everyone is "shocked" that they can't keep the same artificial budget projection they set forth. Nevermind the design changes, etc. I don't know anything about building airplanes, but I've got clients in businesses like construction where they take bids and if a major criteria is cost, you wouldn't believe how they lie.

[neoplacebo]

The bumper on my car is all plastic, probably with little metal rods connecting it to the frame. It even wraps around the sides to the back of the rear wheels. A whale of a plastic bumper, as it were. The front one is pretty much the same. I just try not to get hit or hit anything. I will sell this plastic bumper high performance car for six thousand dollars; it's in fine shape, takes premium fuel, and will actually go like hell. It also gets about 22 miles per gallon on the highway in top gear. If you drive it in high performance mode, it only gets about 15 miles per gallon. I suppose the plastic bumpers are for "high performance." As an aside, this car was made in Canada in January 1999.