bannination wrote: "However in reality they're not forcing anything on you, they just want the same rights as you have." Of course, as a human, they have rights; even to be deviates. Your argument was that Christians want Biblical beliefs made into laws everyone has to follow; whereas I compared legalizing perversion to be no different.
"Treating a human as a lesser being than yourself should be a sin. (In fact it probably is, I'm sure it's just ignored in this case.)" It may very well be so, but a homosexual is a sinner that puts their lusts before God."
"Not everyone thinks that." Who, for instance?
"Are you prepared to live under Jewish or Muslim laws? That's the kinda crap you're starting." And what body of lawmakers are considering those laws? I'm no lawmaker, so I'm not starting anything. This is an opinion/debate forum, and I'm expressing my opinion on homosexuality vs. religion.
If Christians had their way, perversion would still be illegal; if atheists had their way, anything to do with God or the Bible would be done away with and "if it feels good, do it" would be law.....so it appears we're at an impasse.
I'd say we're not at an impasse, your God is so weak that you think you have to enforce his laws. You claim god give people free will, yet YOU want to stand in the way of God's gift.
I just watched JTA's video on ISIS...... it's scary how close you are to them. Put a gun in your hand with a gang that tells you the gays must die because they are an affront to God, and.... wow...
That's exactly why religion must be opposed in government.
There's a lot of Christians that disagree with you Mr. B, and the number is growing every day. Tick tock.
--The sad thing is that you don't believe in any of this crap any more than I do, you just use it as an excuse to exert your will on others that are powerless. Go handle some poisonous snakes and see if the bible is true. (Just in case you don't get what Neoplacebo is getting at.)
Furthermore:
"A lot of Christians including you Mr. B. don't care about the freedom to worship as you please (you already have that), you want to force your beliefs into law for the rest of us."
Mr.B:
Including me? Citation?..... or am I guilty only by association?
bannination wrote: "your God is so weak that you think you have to enforce his laws." Huh?...that makes no sense at all!
"You claim God give people free will, yet YOU want to stand in the way of God's gift." I'm not standing in anyone's way...you're saying homosexuality is a gift from God? Satan gives gifts too.....
"Put a gun in your hand with a gang that tells you the gays must die because they are an affront to God, and.... wow..." Gays are an affront to God, but judgment on them is not my/our place. That's the difference between Christians and radical groups that use ideology in guise of religion
"That's exactly why religion must be opposed in government." So that government can legalize perversion?
"There's a lot of Christians that disagree with you Mr. B, and the number is growing every day. Tick tock." 'Just because one calls........' well, you know; you ain't no dummy, you know exactly what I mean, and you know it's true.
"--The sad thing is that you don't believe in any of this crap any more than I do, you just use it as an excuse to exert your will on others that are powerless. Go handle some poisonous snakes and see if the bible is true. (Just in case you don't get what Neoplacebo is getting at.)" If I didn't believe in God, I wouldn't be wasting my time bickering with you et al, because, to be honest with you, your hate is pathetic and to be pitied. As far as handling snakes, I'm not afraid of them, but I don't intend to tempt God just to put on a show; that's all snake handling is....a show.
bannination wrote: "your God is so weak that you think you have to enforce his laws." Huh?...that makes no sense at all!
Not to speak for Banni, but to me it is quite clear. God, however described, created the entire universe and everything in it. If God has laws, s/he has the means to enforce them on an eternal basis. Transgressors will be sent straight to Hell without passing Go.
There is no need - or effect on the ultimate result - for humans to participate in the enforcement process on God's behalf. That is putting humans on the level of a God, or even worse, turning an all-powerful God into a humanish creation.
bannination wrote: "your God is so weak that you think you have to enforce his laws." Huh?...that makes no sense at all! That's cause you don't have brain, O`Really figured it out.
"You claim God give people free will, yet YOU want to stand in the way of God's gift." I'm not standing in anyone's way...you're saying homosexuality is a gift from God? Satan gives gifts too..... Didn't "god" create homosexuality?
"Put a gun in your hand with a gang that tells you the gays must die because they are an affront to God, and.... wow..." Gays are an affront to God, but judgment on them is not my/our place. That's the difference between Christians and radical groups that use ideology in guise of religion You're just one step away from those radical groups.
"That's exactly why religion must be opposed in government." So that government can legalize perversion? No, they're legalizing marriage and giving everyone equal rights. The ghey sects is happening anyway.
"There's a lot of Christians that disagree with you Mr. B, and the number is growing every day. Tick tock." 'Just because one calls........' well, you know; you ain't no dummy, you know exactly what I mean, and you know it's true. Yes, and they say you are not a Christian. For once I'm in agreement with some Christians. You're making judgement.
"--The sad thing is that you don't believe in any of this crap any more than I do, you just use it as an excuse to exert your will on others that are powerless. Go handle some poisonous snakes and see if the bible is true. (Just in case you don't get what Neoplacebo is getting at.)" If I didn't believe in God, I wouldn't be wasting my time bickering with you et al, because, to be honest with you, your hate is pathetic and to be pitied. As far as handling snakes, I'm not afraid of them, but I don't intend to tempt God just to put on a show; that's all snake handling is....a show.
Chicken shit. You know your fairly tale isn't true. Tempting God? He plainly told you that you can do it? How is following his book "tempting"?? I'm hateful? You are one of the ones that intent on destroying peoples one chance of having a happy life. You're the one treating people as subhuman. Look in the mirror.
I don't know what the big deal is; I really don't. God is money, money is God. Everybody knows that but many don't admit it. I think the fact that God warned us about money proves this.
O Really wrote: "Not to speak for Banni, but to me it is quite clear." You should speak for Banni.....appears he ain't got good enough sense to speak for himself!
"If God has laws, s/he has the means to enforce them on an eternal basis." Don't underestimate Him.
"Transgressors will be sent straight to Hell without passing Go." If that were the case, God would have destroyed Adam and Eve and started over. God told A&E that if they ate of the fruit, they would die.
Satan convinced Eve that she would not die, but would grow in knowledge. God did not literally kill Adam and Eve because of His compassion and love for His creation, but they were allowed to suffer. That, in effect was the death penalty, but God also gave mankind the opportunity to redeem himself. Those who reject God suffer the second death; the first death is physical death, the second is spiritual death...being rejected by God.
"And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened,
which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works."
"And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them:
and they were judged every man according to their works."
"And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death."
"There is no need - or effect on the ultimate result - for humans to participate in the enforcement process on God's behalf.
That is putting humans on the level of a God, or even worse, turning an all-powerful God into a humanish creation." We're not trying to enforce anything.....the Bible teaches to be concerned for the salvation of those who are in living in sin, and homosexuality is sin, regardless whether it's called love, equal rights, tolerance, bigotry, homophobia, or whatever other name can be dreamed up.
Granted, some Christians go (or have gone) to extremes in their treatment and attitudes towards homosexuals (as an individual). That is wrong. God's Word says...(here we go again) to "love the sinner, hate the sin."
Bannination wrote:"Didn't God (sic) create homosexuality?"
It seems to me that God is either all-powerful or S/He's not. If Satan can create things that God doesn't like, then Satan is as powerful, in essence two Gods. If God can over-rule Satan, then Satan isn't as powerful and can't really create anything God doesn't like. Reminds me of the existential question, "If God is all-powerful, creator of all, etc., can He create a rock that's too heavy for him to lift?
Mr.B wrote:
"Transgressors will be sent straight to Hell without passing Go." If that were the case, God would have destroyed Adam and Eve and started over. God told A&E that if they ate of the fruit, they would die.
Satan convinced Eve that she would not die, but would grow in knowledge. God did not literally kill Adam and Eve because of His compassion and love for His creation, but they were allowed to suffer. That, in effect was the death penalty, but God also gave mankind the opportunity to redeem himself. Those who reject God suffer the second death; the first death is physical death, the second is spiritual death...being rejected by God.
Ironically Satan was telling the truth and god lied in that story. Interesting eh?
bannination wrote: "That's cause you don't have brain, O`Really figured it out." Oh, I've got brain, plenty of it. You're demonstrating the typical attitude of one without a sensible argument.
"You're just one step away from those radical groups." Only in your mind.
"....they're legalizing marriage and giving everyone equal rights...The ghey sects is happening anyway." And that's why marriages of perversion are being legalized, it's happening anyway.
"There's a lot of Christians that disagree with you Mr. B, and the number is growing every day...and they say you are not a Christian.
For once I'm in agreement with some Christians. You're making judgement." That "lot of Christians" can disagree all they want; I know what the Bible says, and man, no matter what he calls himself or how big he is in society, doesn't have the final say-so. Even I don't have the final say-so, but I don't recall God sending me or anyone else an email, text, or watered-down Bible that said He's changed His mind....therefore, I can only judge what I see, and I know the difference between an apple tree and a fig tree.
"You are one of the ones that intent on destroying peoples one chance of having a happy life. You're the one treating people as subhuman." Satan is the one intent on destroying people; he's alive and well and spreading his evil and granting "happy lives" to those that God referred to as an abomination.
I've not treated anyone in any manner; I've only spoken opinions on the subject.
bannination wrote:"Ironically Satan was telling the truth and God lied in that story. Interesting eh?"
God said they would die; He didn't specify physically or spiritually. Satan convinced Eve that God meant literally killing them; he knew God would not physically kill them; so "ironically" Satan lied.
bannination wrote:"Ironically Satan was telling the truth and God lied in that story. Interesting eh?"
God said they would die; He didn't specify physically or spiritually. Satan convinced Eve that God meant literally killing them; he knew God would not physically kill them; so "ironically" Satan lied.
What an amazing twist! Make up a word that literally means nothing, then say that died. Even in this case "god" is being quite deceptive. "Satan" (Actually just a talking snake, he's never referred to as such.) still told the truth.
O Really wrote: "It seems to me that God is either all-powerful or S/He's not. If Satan can create things that God doesn't like, then Satan is as powerful, in essence two Gods. If God can over-rule Satan, then Satan isn't as powerful and can't really create anything God doesn't like."
God gave Satan free reign over Job to prove to him who's more powerful; God gave man "over to a reprobate mind" meaning man could choose to follow God or follow Satan
Of course, none of you here believe in God (or Satan), and you are well aware of what the Bible says.
I'm aware I'm just spinning my wheels while y'all toy with me.
bannination wrote:"You keep saying that "God" says being gay is an abomination. Please cite where Jesus said this."
Look it up; look closely starting with Matthew 1:1 and read on.....but you know the answer to that already.
Mr.B wrote:
Of course, none of you here believe in God (or Satan), and you are well aware of what the Bible says.
I'm aware I'm just spinning my wheels while y'all toy with me.
Not entirely accurate. Some of us may very well believe in a true God, but not particularly a humanized one. A God who creates the universe isn't likely to play games with His/Her creations, pretending to allow dissension or disobedience when S/He holds all power in the universe. God exists, but did not originate with the Old or New Testament version. The True God was around for many millions of years before that, and will be around for many after the last Bible is as forgotten as the rites of Homo heidelbergensis.
bannination wrote: "What an amazing twist! Make up a word that literally means nothing, then say that died." Whatever that's supposed to mean..
"Even in this case God is being quite deceptive. "Satan" (Actually just a talking snake, he's never referred to as such.) still told the truth."
"And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
"For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil."
"Unto the woman He said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children;
and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee." (Vrede's gonna have a cow over that one!)
"And unto Adam He said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;"
bannination wrote: "What an amazing twist! Make up a word that literally means nothing, then say that died." Whatever that's supposed to mean..
"Even in this case God is being quite deceptive. "Satan" (Actually just a talking snake, he's never referred to as such.) still told the truth."
"And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
"For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil."
"Unto the woman He said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children;
and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee." (Vrede's gonna have a cow over that one!)
"And unto Adam He said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;"
Not sure what you're trying to prove here other than god lied in the story.
Satan gives gifts too..... 
