Guns, race, religion, terror, wingnut thread

[Vrede too]

It's a dumb suit. If she's even dumber for not insisting on contingency only, good.

[Seth Milner]

It's what's known as a Steve Dallas lawsuit. Forget who is responsible; you go after whoever has the most money regardless of how remotely they're linked to the incident.

And it's not a question of whether she'll get paid. It's whether the lawyer will get paid.

Having convinced a grieving widow to file suit, the lawyer will likely extract payment from the widow if he can't extract one from the county.

(Renee) Wetzel is seeking $3 million from San Bernardino County for loss of wages and $25 million in general damages. She is also seeking $10 million in general damages for each of her three minor children.

The claim, which lists the county and 25 unidentified individuals as respondents, alleges the 37-year-old Wetzel's death "was preventable and caused by the negligent and careless actions of respondents."

Andrew J. Nissen, one of two attorneys representing Renee Wetzel and her children, declined to elaborate about the negligence claims against the county.

I wonder why he won't elaborate? Friggin' heartless, money-grubbing vulture.

[O Really]

Perhaps I can elaborate, though I am fortunate not to be a personal injury lawyer. The victims were at work, doing whatever they were supposed to be doing, and were killed by a fellow employee. Forget the politics and drama, if an employee gets injured or killed by a fellow employee while at work, it's going to be covered under workers' compensation. Ordinarily, if an injury is covered by WC, the injured employee (or their family) can't sue the employer - that's what WC is for, to avoid those lawsuits. Or maybe they're trying to deny WC, and the injured can sue over that. They can sue a third party if one is responsible for the injury, but the only way to sue the employer is if ...drum roll....wait for it...the employer is grossly negligent! So that's what they have to say. How might they have been negligent? I don't know, but there might be claims of "negligent hiring and retention" if the employer kept on a known loon. Or if the shooter did get into an altercation, the employer (theoretically) should not have let them back in the building. There is a path, narrow though it may be, to say that if you're killed at work that somehow the employer is responsible.

As to fees, there's no doubt this is contingency. That's the way personal injury works. The only way it wouldn't be is if the widow wanted to sue and the lawyer told her she really had no chance and she begged him/her into it, then she'd also have to pay some fees for the useless time of complaint preparation and filing, etc.

[rstrong]

Oregon Live: Self-appointed 'judge' arrives in Burns to ask local residents to charge government officials with crimes

Self-proclaimed U.S. Superior Court Judge Bruce Doucette (not a real judge) arrived in Harney County Tuesday and is readying militiamen for a "grand jury trial." Naturally, Doucette has a history of such fantasy role playing with the sovereign citizen movement. In the real world he owns a small computer repair business in Denver.

At least the kangaroo court has received by mail something they can use as a gavel.

[Vrede too]

Is a holiday party considered to be "at work"?

I haven't seen any reporting about "known loon" or "an altercation", everyone seemed surprised by the act.

Unless something completely new is revealed, I think she'll have better luck with "Self-proclaimed U.S. Superior Court Judge Bruce Doucette " and his new "gavel".

[rstrong]

Is a holiday party considered to be "at work"?

In Canada it is, at least on one level. Courts have decided that an employer has at least some responsibility for ensuring that employees don't drive drunk on the way home from the company Christmas party.

[O Really]

Is a holiday party considered to be "at work"?

In Canada it is, at least on one level. Courts have decided that an employer has at least some responsibility for ensuring that employees don't drive drunk on the way home from the company Christmas party.

There's that. But also in this instance the event was also billed as a "training session" that was held during normal working hours on the employer's premises.

It was reported early on that the guy left the meeting following an argument with a fellow employee. Don't know what that amounted to, though, or whether the report was even accurate.

I don't think the case appears very strong, but I know very little about personal injury. I do know that PI firms are reluctant to spend money chasing leprechauns and unicorns, so there's probably some viable legal theory of some sort there.

[Vrede too]

You are correct - "a semi-annual all-staff meeting and training event, and was in the process of transitioning into a department holiday party/luncheon".

But:
It was "a rented banquet room" at the "Inland Regional Center ... a government-funded not-for-profit public benefit corporation".
I don't think there was any altercation, this was clearly planned before the event and saying, "Don't come back," would not have worked.
There had been some prior workplace discussion between the male terrorist and one of the victims, a bigoted Christian that regularly spewed on social media. If anyone, the Christian would have most qualified as a "known loon". I wonder if it's his widow suing.

[O Really]

Given the stated purpose, the location wouldn't matter. Still working time, still covered under Workers' comp.
I'd agree the plaintiff will have a difficult time showing negligence rising to the level necessary to get past the WC, but that's what they have to say to get into the game.

[Vrede too]

Given the stated purpose, the location wouldn't matter....

Agreed, I was just clearing it up.

[rstrong]

Y’All Qa’eda just got a 55 gallon drum of lube to go with all those dildos
One of Amazon's all-time gag items, sent courtesy of Max "Cards Against Humanity" Temkin.

Comments:

I’m impressed you sprung for the expedited shipping.

If it were a nonprofit preserve I'd say slip 'n slide fundraiser

And now they'll have a dipping sauce!

My country 'tis of thee ... *tears* ... sweet land of Liberty ...

that’s a pretty good deal on shipping let’s be honest

If anyone can turn lubricant into lubriCAN it's that plucky band of heroes.

You buried the lede here, Max: it only costs $17.99 to ship a 55-gallon drum of personal lubricant!!!

Dude that's a pretty extreme way to affect your "Recommended For You" listings.

The shipping manifest reads only: "Condiments."

you’re a slippery one, mister t

This is Right and Good.

I wonder what the folks at Amazon think of the deliveries to the Oregon militia. I bet someone's got an office pool going.

how do you ship a 55 gallon drum of lube "discreetly"?

Sounds like a slippery slope to me.

To be fair they did ask folks to stop sending dildos.

It's on your conscience when the #BundyMilitia uses the personal lubricant for cooking.

also, how weird is it that you can mail stuff to a compound seized by force?

The right to lube shall not be abridged...

was that Prime eligible?

That UPS driver is going to hate you.

[billy.pilgrim]

The bundi nuts have a tech guy.

Here is a taste of his social media postings

 “ALL I WANT FOR CHRISTMAS IS FOR ISIS TO NUKE ISRAELHELL!” he wrote on the site Nov. 30. 

reckon hate and stupidity are the only requirements to be a bundiman

[rstrong]

I wonder if that's the same IT guy who is their sovereign citizen self-proclaimed "U.S. Superior Court Judge."

[billy.pilgrim]

I wonder if that's the same IT guy who is their sovereign citizen self-proclaimed "U.S. Superior Court Judge."

Sorry, forgot the link

http://m.dailykos.com/story/2016/01/13/ ... tail=email

[rstrong]

The bundi nuts have a tech guy.

Here is a taste of his social media postings

 “ALL I WANT FOR CHRISTMAS IS FOR ISIS TO NUKE ISRAELHELL!” he wrote on the site Nov. 30. 

reckon hate and stupidity are the only requirements to be a bundiman

Naturally, he's followed it up with...

RawStory: Ammon Bundy’s resident computer expert insists pro-ISIS social media posts were a joke

Sounds familiar.

[Vrede too]

... RawStory: Ammon Bundy’s resident computer expert insists pro-ISIS social media posts were a joke

Sounds familiar.

... also, how weird is it that you can mail stuff to a compound seized by force? ....

Not as weird as one might think. Post offices don't make political judgments. I remember when English nonviolent highway-blocking tree-sitters got delivery just by putting boxes at the base of their trees.

[rstrong]

... also, how weird is it that you can mail stuff to a compound seized by force? ....

Not as weird as one might think. Post offices don't make political judgments. I remember when English nonviolent highway-blocking tree-sitters got delivery just by putting boxes at the base of their trees.

The militia LARPers insist that they're under siege. Which is hard to do when the authorities simply let anyone - including supplies and postal delivery - come and go.

The FBI is instead treating it more like a parenting challenge. "Fine, hold your breath as long as you want."

[Vrede too]

It's hard to gain sympathy and raise money based on merely visiting a wildlife refuge.

[O Really]

So I was thinking about these clowns and wondered what they really expect to happen here. They can't stay in there forever, and when they come out, somebody is going to start serving warrants. Maybe one of them will try to be a martyr, but I'm guessing most of these guys aren't nearly as tough by themselves as they think they are holed up by themselves in their "Alamo." Do they think there will be no charges? Or maybe they think they can use their arrests to do the Dennis speech from "Holy Grail?" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxGqcCeV3qk

[rstrong]

Perhaps they're angling for a Reality TV deal. They could easily be the next Honey Boo Boo.