The Worker Thread

[JTA]

It's really depressing. Many people I know would like to explore the country and check out some new places, take some backpacking trips, etc, but the biggest hurdle in them doing so is they simply don't have the time. Most people I know have between 5 and 10 days paid time off per year. That's almost nothing. Subtract time having to go visit your family out of state for the holidays, and time you need to take off for personal matters (DMV, doctor, dentist, etc..), and people really have no time to do anything. We're slaves. Employers seem to be weird about taking unpaid time off, sometimes, too.

[O Really]

... Evidence shows that even now, when employers are prohibited from pocketing tips, many still do. Research on workers in three large U.S. cities

I certainly wouldn't dispute that. Everybody knows that scumbaggery runs rampant in the hospitality/food/service sectors (as well as everywhere else, really, but still...) And I'm not defending Trump's rule by any means. It is a prime example of scumbaggery without reason. But here's the thing - if an employee gets paid at least minimum wage, s/he has no protected right to receive tips, and the employer can, for example, put up a "no tips" sign or can tack on a "service charge" and do with it what it pleases. Overall, the tip system benefits employers as much as employees - allowing them to pay less in exchange for the employee begging from the customers. An employer who isn't a scumbag won't take advantage of the Trump rule because it's not in it's best interest, and the ones that are scumbags will keep having to hire dregs - over and over and over and complain that "nobody wants to work-can't hire good help anymore..."

[Vrede too]

Sign the petition to McDonald’s

McDonald’s, you just scored $700 million in Trump’s tax scam – it’s time to raise wages to $15/hour and support union rights.

[Vrede too]

Christmas tree cutters' labor fight shines light on holiday season's forgotten workers
In the mountains of North Carolina, low-wage workers scored a hard-earned victory on safety and pay – but Republicans in the state are retaliating

Unions, because God won't even help Christmas tree workers.

[Vrede too]

Ten actions that hurt workers during Trump’s first year
How Trump and Congress further rigged the economy in favor of the wealthy

Ironic that POSPOTUS won thanks to some working class whites ditching the Dems.

[O Really]

First they ditched the unions, then the Dems. Probably use lottery tickets for a retirement fund. Fershure, largely because of decline in union membership, the Dems have been courting bigger money people and haven't done that much for workers lately, but neither have they caused much harm. Even without a lot of direct benefits, Dems will appoint people on NLRB, EEOC, etc. that will be more pro-worker. Republicans, not so much.

[rstrong]

First they ditched the unions, then the Dems. Probably use lottery tickets for a retirement fund.

The younger ones are wondering which payday loan company to borrow from to buy Bitcoin.

[Vrede too]

... the Dems have been courting bigger money people and haven't done that much for workers lately ...

There was rescuing the economy, 8 years of steady (though slow) growth, getting healthcare for tens of millions and all of the regulatory changes that POSPOTUS is now cancelling, but none of that is as sexy as sparking fear of and loathing for immigrants. However, you are correct that other than a few like Bernie and Warren the Dems have not made the case that they are fighting for workers vs. the bigger money people.

[Vrede too]

From the 'Nobody Should Be Surprised' file:

Women would lose $4.6 billion in earned tips if the administration’s ‘tip stealing’ rule is finalized
Overall, workers would lose $5.8 billion

[billy.pilgrim]

From the 'Nobody Should Be Surprised' file:

Women would lose $4.6 billion in earned tips if the administration’s ‘tip stealing’ rule is finalized
Overall, workers would lose $5.8 billion

I knew men were undertipped, but ...

[O Really]

If people get the idea that their server isn't getting the tips they leave, they'll probably stop leaving any. I would/will. I'd ask the server if s/he gets to keep tips, though. Most people probably won't ask, just stop tipping.

[Vrede too]

Absent a living wage, I like the tip incentive.

If people get the idea that their server isn't getting the tips they leave, they'll probably stop leaving any. I would/will. I'd ask the server if s/he gets to keep tips, though. Most people probably won't ask, just stop tipping.

Might some servers get punished for honestly answering your question in the negative?

I try to leave cash, figuring it's most likely to stay in the servers' pockets.

[billy.pilgrim]

Absent a living wage, I like the tip incentive.

If people get the idea that their server isn't getting the tips they leave, they'll probably stop leaving any. I would/will. I'd ask the server if s/he gets to keep tips, though. Most people probably won't ask, just stop tipping.

Might some servers get punished for honestly answering your question in the negative?

I try to leave cash, figuring it's most likely to stay in the servers' pockets.

I'm not so sure
Let the owner pay the wait staff what they deserve, or tell the ones who can't wait tables that waiting tables ain't for them.

Too much of what we have now is the tease of "big" money that never pays off for most - until they can't pay the bills.

[O Really]

Personally, I don't like group tips - jar or whatever. I like a tip to be a "thank you" for providing service - to the person who provided the service. Thanks for giving me a pleasurable meal experience - or for making sure my car is clean without water spots - or for giving a really interesting tour. Tossing money into a jar expresses no appreciation to anyone, it just increases the cost of the event.

[Vrede too]

Personally, I don't like group tips - jar or whatever. I like a tip to be a "thank you" for providing service - to the person who provided the service. Thanks for giving me a pleasurable meal experience - or for making sure my car is clean without water spots - or for giving a really interesting tour. Tossing money into a jar expresses no appreciation to anyone, it just increases the cost of the event.

I agree when there's table service. If it's just counter service and their are few employees working like Subway and some Starbucks, tip jars don't bother me.

[billy.pilgrim]

In the Freakonomics blog entitled Should Tipping be Banned? Stephen Dubner and Steven Levitt discussed the issue of gratuities. The authors pointed out that research by Michael Lynn found that "attractive waitresses get better tips than less attractive waitresses. Men’s appearance, not so important". Lynn's research also found that "blondes get better tips than brunettes. Slender women get better tips than heavier women. Large breasted women get better tips than smaller breasted women".




But I thought it was about service

[O Really]

.
But I thought it was about service

The perception of service - or the toleration of poor service - increases in direct proportion to the attractiveness of the server. At least among the still-large number of males who tend to see all women as sex objects. Since the majority of bill-payers/tip leavers are still male, it's not surprising that "Hooters" type women get tipped better than "Flo" types or gay guys.

[billy.pilgrim]

.
But I thought it was about service

The perception of service - or the toleration of poor service - increases in direct proportion to the attractiveness of the server. At least among the still-large number of males who tend to see all women as sex objects. Since the majority of bill-payers/tip leavers are still male, it's not surprising that "Hooters" type women get tipped better than "Flo" types or gay guys.

Which leads to the conclusion that responsible employers should pay the servers and wait staff based on abilities - not tittie size.

[O Really]

Which leads to the conclusion that responsible employers should pay the servers and wait staff based on abilities - not tittie size.

I'm in favor of employers having to pay their employees, and have never liked the "tip credit" they can get. However, even in non-tipped jobs, employers have long rewarded tittie size, or at least attractiveness. It is written, "it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a fat chick to get hired as pharmaceutical rep."

[Vrede too]

I'm in favor of employers having to pay their employees, and have never liked the "tip credit" they can get. However, even in non-tipped jobs, employers have long rewarded tittie size, or at least attractiveness. It is written, "it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a fat chick to get hired as pharmaceutical rep."

True, but that's the case regardless of whether folks are tipped or are paid a living wage. If we went with living wage:
Big breasts would lose some of the tip advantage that they get on top of the hiring advantage.
The hiring advantage would also be reduced. Some bosses hire big breasts exactly because they figure that more tips will make them happier workers and more likely to stick around.