Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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Ulysses
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Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

Way to go, Oakies! (/s)
McALESTER, Okla. (AP) — Oklahoma administered the death penalty Thursday on a man who convulsed and vomited as he was executed for the 1998 slaying of a prison cafeteria worker, ending a six-year execution moratorium brought on by concerns over its execution methods,

John Marion Grant, 60, who was strapped to a gurney inside the execution chamber, began convulsing and vomiting after the first drug, the sedative midazolam, was administered. Several minutes later, two members of the execution team wiped the vomit from his face and neck.

Before the curtain was raised to allow witnesses to see into the execution chamber, Grant could be heard yelling, “Let’s go! Let’s go! Let’s go!” He delivered a stream of profanities before the lethal injection started. He was declared unconscious about 15 minutes after the first of three drugs was administered and declared dead about six minutes after that, at 4:21 p.m.

Someone vomiting while being executed is rare, according to observers.

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O Really
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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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Shoulda used a veterinarian.

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:18 am
Shoulda used a veterinarian.
Seriously, I don't get it.

I've put pets down and it's always been very tranquil for them (I'm the one that's a wreck and needs a sedative).
Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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GoCubsGo wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:37 am
O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:18 am
Shoulda used a veterinarian.
Seriously, I don't get it.

I've put pets down and it's always been very tranquil for them (I'm the one that's a wreck and needs a sedative).
Yeah, I was serious. Killing somebody isn't rocket science. Vets can drop a horse safely and peaceably and he's gone almost instantly. Or, looking at another alternative, doctors use general anesthesia all the time without their patients convulsing and vomiting (don't they, Vrede?) Hell, it's a national issue of people overdosing on Fentynal. How hard can it be send a guy off efficiently?

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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If you bothered to read the LINKED article, the same damn thing happened six years ago... in same state of Oklahoma... And as I recall, they used the same damn euthanasia formula that failed six years ago...

The REAL answer to all this is to do away with the death penalty entirely.

How interesting none of you well intentioned folks thought of that.

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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PS-I fully expect to be told to repost this in the Death Penalty thread.

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:46 am
GoCubsGo wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:37 am
O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:18 am
Shoulda used a veterinarian.
Seriously, I don't get it.

I've put pets down and it's always been very tranquil for them (I'm the one that's a wreck and needs a sedative).
Yeah, I was serious. Killing somebody isn't rocket science. Vets can drop a horse safely and peaceably and he's gone almost instantly. Or, looking at another alternative, doctors use general anesthesia all the time without their patients convulsing and vomiting (don't they, Vrede?) Hell, it's a national issue of people overdosing on Fentynal. How hard can it be send a guy off efficiently?
Huh. It's apparently a "supply problem". Though a little old, the article addresses what we're talking about.

https://www.livescience.com/51389-why-l ... arder.html
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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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GoCubsGo wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:56 am
O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:46 am
GoCubsGo wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:37 am
O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:18 am
Shoulda used a veterinarian.
Seriously, I don't get it.

I've put pets down and it's always been very tranquil for them (I'm the one that's a wreck and needs a sedative).
Yeah, I was serious. Killing somebody isn't rocket science. Vets can drop a horse safely and peaceably and he's gone almost instantly. Or, looking at another alternative, doctors use general anesthesia all the time without their patients convulsing and vomiting (don't they, Vrede?) Hell, it's a national issue of people overdosing on Fentynal. How hard can it be send a guy off efficiently?
Huh. It's apparently a "supply problem". Though a little old, the article addresses what we're talking about.

https://www.livescience.com/51389-why-l ... arder.html
It's not a supply problem, really. It's because the companies that make better sedatives no longer want them used for human executions. It's an ethical problem. Let's see... if a pharmaceutical company says you cannot use its product to kill people, and nothing else works acceptably, what's the logical alternative?

Oh, wait... I got it...

STOP KILLING PEOPLE!

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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Ulysses wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:52 am
If you bothered to read the LINKED article, the same damn thing happened six years ago... in same state of Oklahoma... And as I recall, they used the same damn euthanasia formula that failed six years ago...

The REAL answer to all this is to do away with the death penalty entirely.

How interesting none of you well intentioned folks thought of that.
I have long been an opponent of state-sanctioned killing and think it's better all around for society to have life without parole sentences. On the other hand, I've known of some people that just don't deserve to live. But in any case, the current process of Death (maybe) Penalty is really crappy.

Oklahoma, Texas, et. al. is going to do whatever they want whether we (or their own citizens) like it or not. I'm just saying if they're determined to kill a prisoner, they don't have to depend on faulty drugs.

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 1:08 am
Ulysses wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:52 am
If you bothered to read the LINKED article, the same damn thing happened six years ago... in same state of Oklahoma... And as I recall, they used the same damn euthanasia formula that failed six years ago...

The REAL answer to all this is to do away with the death penalty entirely.

How interesting none of you well intentioned folks thought of that.
I have long been an opponent of state-sanctioned killing and think it's better all around for society to have life without parole sentences. On the other hand, I've known of some people that just don't deserve to live. But in any case, the current process of Death (maybe) Penalty is really crappy.

Oklahoma, Texas, et. al. is going to do whatever they want whether we (or their own citizens) like it or not. I'm just saying if they're determined to kill a prisoner, they don't have to depend on faulty drugs.
Answer: take it to the US Supreme Court. If the Supremes say it's not allowed, then we can stop having these debates.

Of course I don't see that happening in my lifetime. So I will (continue to) refrain from any activity that can result in the death penalty. I'm smart that way.

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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GoCubsGo wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:37 am
O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:18 am
Shoulda used a veterinarian.
Seriously, I don't get it.

I've put pets down and it's always been very tranquil for them (I'm the one that's a wreck and needs a sedative).
I have had to put several pets down. I don't like it. OTOH, I had a semi-feral cat that snuck into the house and then died in the closet of a bedroom I was using as a home office. It was not pretty. Hey, but death is a part of life.

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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Ulysses wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 1:12 am


Of course I don't see that happening in my lifetime. So I will (continue to) refrain from any activity that can result in the death penalty. I'm smart that way.
No worries. There are hundreds of things you're more like to die from than a "death penalty". Of course, the time spent in Pelican Bay waiting for the (maybe) death penalty probably wouldn't be pleasant. Average time from sentencing to execution is pushing 20 years. Lotta stuff will kill you in less time.

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 1:19 am
Ulysses wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 1:12 am


Of course I don't see that happening in my lifetime. So I will (continue to) refrain from any activity that can result in the death penalty. I'm smart that way.
No worries. There are hundreds of things you're more like to die from than a "death penalty". Of course, the time spent in Pelican Bay waiting for the (maybe) death penalty probably wouldn't be pleasant. Average time from sentencing to execution is pushing 20 years. Lotta stuff will kill you in less time.
Well, given that, the death penalty makes even less sense.

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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Can't really say I've paid a lot of attention to the death penalty status in California for the last few decades, so I found this illuminating article:
Legal challenges and changes

Beginning in 1967, as a result of various state and United States Supreme Court decisions, there were no executions in California for 25 years.

In February 1972, the California Supreme Court found that the death penalty constituted cruel and unusual punishment under the California state constitution and 107 condemned inmates were resentenced to life with the possibility of parole and removed from California’s death row.

In 1973, the United States Supreme Court held that the death penalty was unconstitutional as it was being administered at that time in a number of states.

In November 1972, the California electorate amended the state constitution and in 1973, legislation was enacted making the death penalty mandatory in specified criminal cases. Among these were kidnapping if the victim dies, train wrecking if any person dies, assault by a life prisoner if the victim dies within a year, treason against the state, and first-degree murder under specific conditions (for hire, of a peace officer, of a witness to prevent testimony, if committed during a robbery or burglary, if committed during the course of a rape by force, if committed during performance of lewd and lascivious acts upon children, by persons previously convicted of murder).

In 1976, the California Supreme Court, basing its decision on a United States Supreme Court ruling earlier that year, held that the California death penalty statute was unconstitutional under the U.S. Constitution because it did not allow mitigating circumstances to be admitted as evidence. Following this ruling, 70 inmates had their sentences changed to other than death.

Capital punishment reinstated

The California State Legislature re-enacted the death penalty statute in 1977. Under the new statute, evidence in mitigation was permitted. The death penalty was reinstated as a possible punishment for first-degree murder under certain conditions. These special circumstances include: murder for financial gain, murder by a person previously convicted of murder, murder of multiple victims, murder with torture, murder of a peace officer, murder of a witness to prevent testimony and several other murders under specified circumstances.

In 1977, the Penal Code also was revised to include the sentence of life imprisonment without the possibility of parole. At that time, the punishment for kidnapping for ransom, extortion or robbery was changed from death to life without parole. Treason, train derailing or wrecking, and securing the death of an innocent person through perjury became punishable by death or life imprisonment without parole.

California voters approved Proposition 7 in November 1978, reaffirming the death penalty in California. It superseded the 1977 statutes and is the death penalty statute under which California currently operates.
Personally I would support a referendum to abolish the death penalty.

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:46 am
Yeah, I was serious. Killing somebody isn't rocket science. Vets can drop a horse safely and peaceably and he's gone almost instantly. Or, looking at another alternative, doctors use general anesthesia all the time without their patients convulsing and vomiting (don't they, Vrede?) Hell, it's a national issue of people overdosing on Fentanyl. How hard can it be send a guy off efficiently?
We often administer an antiemetic if there's a risk. Plus, midazolam (Versed) usually doesn't cause vomiting. My GUESS is that it was a function of a large IV dose pushed too rapidly by an inexperienced provider.
O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 1:19 am
No worries. There are hundreds of things you're more like to die from than a "death penalty". Of course, the time spent in Pelican Bay waiting for the (maybe) death penalty probably wouldn't be pleasant. Average time from sentencing to execution is pushing 20 years. Lotta stuff will kill you in less time.
Capital punishment in California

Capital punishment is a legal penalty in the U.S. state of California. As of March 2019, further executions are halted by an official moratorium ordered by Governor Gavin Newsom. Prior to the moratorium, executions were frozen by a federal court order since 2006, and the litigation resulting in the court order has been on hold since the enactment of the moratorium. Thus, there will be a court-ordered moratorium on executions after the termination of Newsom's moratorium if the death penalty exists in California by then....

As of September 2021, official California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation (CDCR) records show that there are 697 inmates awaiting execution in California, the lowest it has been since 2011, primarily due to suicide, death from other causes, fewer juries willing to sentence people to death, and resentencings by newly elected district attorneys, among other things. 23 of those on death row are females, held at the female death row in the Central California Women's Facility (CCWF) in Chowchilla, with the other 678 inmates awaiting execution being males that are housed throughout the state, although most males are housed in San Quentin State Prison....

Men condemned to death in California must (with some exceptions) be held at San Quentin State Prison ...
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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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Ulysses wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:52 am
The REAL answer to all this is to do away with the death penalty entirely.
STOP KILLING PEOPLE!
O Really wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 1:08 am
I have long been an opponent of state-sanctioned killing and think it's better all around for society to have life without parole sentences.
On the other hand, I've known of some people that just don't deserve to live.
When people stop killing other people (which will never happen), then the state will stop killing people.

All I can add here is this: if any death-penalty opponent could see the many horrors I've seen in my career . . .
a "life without parole sentence" would be a slap on the back of a hand.

I've always thought that an execution should be swift as opposed to the horror and suffering that many victims
endured before they were snuffed out by their cruel tormentors. I will add this; can you imagine the suffering and pain
a human being goes through while they're being skinned alive?

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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Leo Lyons wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 10:21 am
When people stop killing other people (which will never happen), then the state will stop killing people.

All I can add here is this: if any death-penalty opponent could see the many horrors I've seen in my career . . .
a "life without parole sentence" would be a slap on the back of a hand.

I've always thought that an execution should be swift as opposed to the horror and suffering that many victims
endured before they were snuffed out by their cruel tormentors....
The state should behave like murderers do?

Just like with the drug war there is no evidence that the death penalty reduces crime and plenty suggesting that it makes things worse for society. The important issue is what benefits society in the long run, not whether some "deserve" to die.

Also like the drug war there is a long, proven history of racist implementation.

Swift execution increases mistakes and reduces the opportunity to correct them. Do you really believe that govt is infallible and always honest?

"a 'life without parole sentence' would be a slap on the back of a hand" is too silly for words. Personally, I'd prefer to be put to death.
Last edited by Vrede too on Fri Oct 29, 2021 11:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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Vrede too wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 10:08 am

Men condemned to death in California must (with some exceptions) be held at San Quentin State Prison ...
[/quote]

Yeah, I didn't bother to look up where the hypothetical Ulysses would spend personal eternity waiting for his (maybe) execution. Pelican Bay was just on my mind because I had been reading about it. We'll be in Crescent City in a few days and it's so fun to have a supermax down the road. Of course, they've never reported any actual escapes, but it's still not likely a good idea to pick up hitchhikers wearing striped suits.
Spoiler:
They might be the lawyers for the prisoners

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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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Ulysses wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:52 am
If you bothered to read the LINKED article,

Your OP gave zero indication that there was more to the article, not even a "...". Why are you always blaming others for your screw ups?

the same damn thing happened six years ago... in same state of Oklahoma... And as I recall, they used the same damn euthanasia formula that failed six years ago...

If it was important why didn't you quote it? Why are you always blaming others for your screw ups?

The REAL answer to all this is to do away with the death penalty entirely.

How interesting none of you well intentioned folks thought of that.

We've discussed the death penalty here many times (I oppose it). Plus, discussion of incompetence in practice says NOTHING about whether folks feel there ought to be the practice at all. You sure are desperate to feel superior that you make such unfounded assumptions about GoCubsGo and O Really. Why are you so insecure?
Ulysses wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:53 am
PS-I fully expect to be told to repost this in the Death Penalty thread.
There is none, paranoid crybaby. However, it is interesting that your choice to create such a specific title for what could have been a long-lived general topic will ensure that this thread will be quickly forgotten. Opps.
Ulysses wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 1:07 am
It's not a supply problem, really.

Ummm, you say that it is one in your next sentence, dufus.

It's because the companies that make better sedatives no longer want them used for human executions. It's an ethical problem.

Ethical Big Pharma? :lol: They just don't want truckloads of negative PR from an activity with no profit.

Let's see... if a pharmaceutical company says you cannot use its product to kill people ...

Supply problem, duh.
Ulysses wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 1:12 am
Answer: take it to the US Supreme Court. If the Supremes say it's not allowed, then we can stop having these debates....
Ummm, it's been to SCOTUS many many times. Pay attention. We are exactly at the point that SCOTUS has said is acceptable.
Ulysses wrote:
Fri Oct 29, 2021 1:33 am
... Personally I would support a referendum to abolish the death penalty.
I assume you voted on these. Remember?
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Re: Oklahoma executes inmate who dies vomiting and convulsing

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I've been a mixed mind on the death penalty for a long time. Ideologically it certainly seems cruel and unusual. Realistically, there are some crimes so heinous that there is no possibility of redemption.

Does anyone remember Gary Michael Hilton?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Hi ... al_killer)

He murdered and dismembered a lovely older couple in an area I considered a special place that was a favorite hiking area of mine in a place I never considered unsafe. He went on to decapitate a college woman and her dog and others.

Death is overdue for him.
Eamus Catuli~AC 000000 000101 010202 020303 010304 020405....Ahhhh, forget it, it's gonna be a while.

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